RIP Comrade Castro
The stories and information posted here are artistic works of fiction and falsehood.
Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact.
Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact.
RIP Comrade Castro
>>713510555
In memoriem patron
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade
>>713510555
rip in peace comrade
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713510555
>trips
Rest in peace comrade.
Are you a fellow Comrade, OP?
Rest in peace, comrade.
>>713510555
rot commie
Rest in peace, comrade!
>>713510555
Fuck that tinpot dictator.
I don't believe in hell but if there is one he's in it.
>>713511463
Marxism best.
>>713511568
Fuck off faggot.
>>713511658
ML, MLM, what?
>>713511658
Average monthly income in Cuba is 20 dollars.
They have to fix cars from the 50s or do without transportation.
Gays (like you) are put in forced labor camps or thrown in jail.
There's a reason Cubans (outside of Cuba where they'll be punished for not following the mandatory 9 days of mourning) are glad this faggot is dead.
>>713511714
ML
Ma boy Lenin ballin hard in the non-existent heaven.
>>713510555
your standard of living has decreased in the past 60 years congrats on being brainwashed.
>>713511815
You should actually try to find out the truth instead of making shit up.
>>713510555
Trips have spoken, Rest in Peace Comrade
>>713511873
Same. Well met, comrade.
>>713510555
Hasta siempre, Fidel.
>>713510555
rest in peace comrade
now stop being a ghost, we dont believe in that shit
>>713510555
RIH :3
Patria o muerte!
Hasta la victoria siempre Camarada!
>>713511999
my ex was cuban.
Her shitty retarded parents immigrated.
He grandma got her pelvis broken with garden sheers to give birth to her mother.
Communism is a bad joke.
>>713511815
The cubans that i know are very well educated and definitely don't think like you, fucking gringo
>>713512395
Cubans in cuba or cubans that don't live in a third world hellhole?
>>713512009
>>713511873
hola my fellow MLs
Communism is an awful idea. I hope he rots in hell.
>>713512304
Yeah, okay fam
>>713511568
>>713511815
>>713512304
>>713512595
indoctrinated idiots
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
I would sooner die for the cause than live the non-life of a blind and cowardly imperialist subject
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade.
>>713512629
>start looking for cuban hospital pics to btfo commies
>find this
>>713510555
"Rest in Peace comarade"
>>713512677
no u
Lotta useful idiots up in here.
>>713513045
>like this shit doesn't happen in America
and i'm not even a communist
another communist dead
to bad he wasnt a nigger or id celebrate even more
>>713510555
The last bearded Marxist have finally passed away. The Revolution, it seems, have been defeated. Fascists are gaining ground all around the world. The Proletariat is fooled and conned on a daily basis by hollow consumerism and politicians' lies.
Will the people ever take their fate into their own hands?
Rest in peace, comrade. You might be dead, but let us hope that there are yet some small embers of the Revolution, deep in the men's hearts, still alive and ready to engulf the world in flames.
Rest in peace, comrade.
>>713513342
idk this is on some fallout shit.
>>713510555
rest in peace comrade
>>713510555
rest in peace comrade
comrade
rest in peace
rest in peace comrade
>>713510555
>>713513420
Gee guys I really wanna be a communist too but all that 20th century murder makes me worry if I join your club. Are there any guarantees that if I join the revolution I won't end up one of the tens of millions purged after its success?
rest in peace comrade
>>713513768
It's not murder when you are disposing of the traitors of the revolution.
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713513768
Maybe you should learn about it instead of assuming everything you've been told is true.
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713513420
The future is ours.
Rest in peace, comrade.
Rest In Peace comrade
>>713510555
Rest in piece comrade
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713510555
>visited by the ghost of fidel castro
Maduro, are you there?
>Rip in peace comrade
>>713513956
>learn about it man!
>ignores the fact that every communist nation turns into a shithole
>>713513956
Okay so I'm back. Just went and learned about it. And turns out Commies? Worse than Hitler. By seemingly tens and tens of millions.
Castro too! Though his kill count was lower than the others, it is still worse once you adjust for population. Also he jailed more political opponents than Stalin. Which is impressive considering how big Russia is.
Fuck your comrade comrade, and fuck you too.
>>713514774
>i just learned about communism in 30 minutes
You're what's wrong with intellectualism.
>>713514683
>ignores the fact that not every communist nation is a shithole and just trusts what the western world tells him about them
>>713515214
He's right you know kiddo.
You could always provide sources to refute him, if he wasn't right and you weren't full of shit.
>>713514774
you were gone like 15 mins. seriously nigga? step up your troll game
Rest in peace, Comrade
>>713510555
fuck off imperialists commie
>>713515252
name one that isn't.
Que en paz descanse Comrade.
>>713515354
Cuba, USSR, China, basically every Communist country improved under Communism.
If you disagree, then you simply don't know history.
Rest in peace comrade.
>>713510555
>Rest in peace comrade
Rest in peace comrade
rest in piece comrade
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713515418
Improved how?
If you measure a country's success in terms of human happiness I'd say no, you're wrong. Unless you have evidence to prove otherwise.
You do have evidence don't you?
you don't just spout propaganda like a retard do you?
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade.
>>713515599
You should do some studying on your own.
>>713510555
Rest in Peace Comrade.
>>713515685
I have.
Every source I've found shows communism equals shit for most people, while the glorious leaader and his cronies get fat and take all the money.
Now do you have any sources or are you full of shit?
>>713510555
Rest in Reace comrade
PATRIA O MUERTE , VENCEREMOS
>>713515881
I'm not your professor.
But you should ask yourself: Why is there still a huge Marxist movement if it was so objectively bad?
I don't give a shit if some ignorant prick on /b/ knows anything about the world he lives in. I'm telling you that you're wrong. The onus does not lie on me to prove it.
>>713516208
Because it's an attractive concept to people who feel like victims and it's being pushed by organizations like the CAP into universitives in the form of SJW nonsense.
Now, give me proof that communism works.
Rip
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713516425
First, you should realize that "give me proof" isn't how the dialectic works.
Second, it's obvious that you don't know anything about it if you think that Communism has been realized in any of the countries that have tried it.
There was a joke in the USSR:
"Communism is like the horizon. We are ever marching, and yet it is always receding."
Rest In Peace Comrade
>>713517027
So what you're saying is it has never worked.
>>713517137
It has also never been tried.
The same can be said of pure Capitalism.
I never reich the job you did pussy.., und arsheloch
>>713510555
Burn in hell you marxist scum
>>713517335
Oh it's never been tried? what about all those improved nations you mentioned? you know, the shitholes you wouldn't move to.
>>713510555
descanse en paz mi comandante
>>713517552
You can stop being condescending now. The dialectic has no pride.
Socialist countries can have the goal to achieve Communism. The USSR was the most successful of those countries.
>>713515599
In terms of human happiness? Then American must be in the shithole then seine 40% people hate trump. USSR turned Russia into a super power and currently has the 2nd best military.
China is an economic power house to the Americans who sit around and whine that there jobs are being taken away. Castro increased health care, education, and got rid of legal discrimination.
"National Socialism" for ever mine führer
>>713517869
yeah world war 2 had nothing to do with that fluke. So how's the USSR now? oh that's right it's dissolved and is now a democracy of sorts.
Castro jailed gay activists you goober.
As far as China, we'll see how long that lasts now that the globalists are out of power.
>>713517832
>You can stop being condescending now.
You started it faggot. Then you backpedalled because your narrative broke because it's total bullshit.
>>713513420
TOTAL HORSESHIT..commie scumbag
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade
>>713518148
Again, like I said, I can't fight National-level Cold War propaganda.
I can open peoples' eyes, but I can't change their minds.
>>713510555
Yesssss, one down. Sssso many more to go.
discord PRufZ
>>713518331
You've done neither. You said "well communism works for lots of nations!" then I asked you which nations....at which point you realized there are none. So you said "well it's never been tried before".
But it has been tried before, it doesn't work. it creates hotbeds of tyranny, corruption, and human suffering.
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade
>>713518154
That's a rather appropriate and well-handled response.
>>713517832
tbh, "it was never tried" is a retarded argument.
The socialist countries that you mentioned never actually "tried true communism", because it's not fucking reachable.
USSR was a shit-hole for most people.
>>713510555
rest in peace comrade
>>713518490
Communism starts with socialism, and then the state dissolves into real communism. In real communism the state has to dissolve or disappear somehow, that hasn't happened yet. Therefore, no real communism has been achieved.
Rest in peace comrade
>>713518490
not >>713518331
but Yugoslavia was doing quite well before being ripped apart by nationalist tensions.
It took the richest part, Slovenia 5-6 years to reach pre-independence wealth, Croatia reached similar affluence in 2012 I believe and the rest of the countries are still worse off.
RIP Comrade Castro
>>713517912
Nazism is cancer.
>>713510555
rest in peace comrade
>>713519010
So your claim that many countries have been improved by communism was what? Because I'm going to say it was bullshit.
rest in peace comrade
>>713518490
Stalin turned Russia from a loose association of agrarian states into an industrial superpower in a matter of decades.
The USSR was one of the first countries to implement paid maternal leave.
The USSR had a competitive standard of living at the time.
Universal healthcare. Universal income. Free higher education. One of the greatest scientific workplaces in Stalingrad.
I've worked in this field for all of my academic career. This comes from years of study. There's no single source you can point to, but you have to understand the context of the Cold War, the battle of ideologies, Containment, and getting at history that has no pro-western bias.
Rest in peace comrade
>>713519396
*Leningrad, sorry
>>713519142
Why was Tito so based?
>>713519168
Says you fag..Became the greatest single nation of all time..Void of faggots ,porn and bullshit..and oh yeah jew bankers
LONG LIVE THE REPUBLIC
>>713519299
It wasn't me that claimed that, somebody else. Just saying, no country has tried real communism, since the state hasn't dissolved.
>>713519576
The very definition of a great man.
Need more people like him and Vladimir Ilyich.
>>713518148
Democracy of sorts. That's pretty funny considering Putin is basically the USSR playing nice. Russia still has one of the best armies even after the USSR dissolved. China is only gaining power it's military becoming of the best next to Russia. Cuba didn't jail gays as your thinking. Gays worked in a labor camp alongside others who didn't participate in the army as every man was supposed to. Since they didn't serve they instead did labor for a amount of time
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade
>>713519967
Uh. That IS Vladimir Ilyich.
>>713519624
Jews aren't necessarily bad people. In communism religion doesn't exist therefore it's basically impossible to be a jew. Gays were usually put in labor camps, although I don't agree with that, and porn isn't really a bad thing. You browse a webpage full of it 24/7.
>>713519967
>>713520158
nvm i see what you're saying
>>713510555
Good night sweet prince
>>713510555
fuck u smelly spic cuck
>>713520099
I know cubans, otherwise I might be convinced. faggot got jailed and raped in jail (ironically) for being a faggot.
>>713520543
You know as well as I do that anecdotal evidence means virtually nothing.
>>713520193
I believe nazis like this >>713519624 gentleman usually aren't bothered about the Jewish religion but the ethnicity.
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
Rest in peace comrade
Hasta la victoria siempre comandante!
>>713520612
All I know is the cubans I know with family in cuba struggled to get out and are thrilled castro is dead.
But you're right it's meaningless for anyone but me and anyone who trusts me which is almost no one on /b/.
>>713520543
Then they let him go and be free? That makes sense.
>>713521037
Nope he didn't make it. I dated his cousin.
>>713510555
Fuck off comie. Por fin se murió este maricon
>>713520956
Castro didn't know gays were being harmed in labor camps (not jails). He went to one saw the cruelty and set reform on them, that's actually history.
>communism in 2016
so, retarded or underaged?
>>713520956
Exactly. There are people in the US who hate our system and want to get out. The economy fails some people.
No system will be perfect for everyone. But we need to escape this mentality of "my country is the best because I live here!" The United States is not a moralistic government. From its very beginnings it has been cruel, elitist, revolutionary. And it's just another case of moral bankruptcy that during and after the Cold War, the US spews propagands to get us to believe that the USSR is a failed country, a shit place to live for everyone, because the ideology is bad.
If it weren't for the US, the USSR may even be alive and well today, and perhaps even surpassing us in productivity and human happiness. Thanks to McCarthyism, Containment, and the Domino Effect though, we will never know.
We could at least be told the truth. I think we're owed that.
>>713521440
very well said, actually
>But we need to escape this mentality of "my country is the best because I live here!"
that is a really good point i think more people should consider
>>713521440
So why do you think it is that Obama, Trudeau, etc are praising Castro as a great leader?
>>713521952
Because he was.
You can't just look at the worst of the worst situations in Cuba and judge the whole country on that.
Given Cuba's history, and what Castro had to work with, he did exceptionally well. Cuba is used as an example to combat the beat-to-death debunked argument of "if everyone gets the same thing, no one will work hard!!!" Cuba has the highest doctor-to-population ratio in the world, and despite what pro-Western cherrypicked pictures of botched surgeries from Cuba tell you, their health care isn't bad. It's also free. We also musn't forget all the botched surgeries here.
>>713521440
>>713522274
damn this nigga is the real deal
still not going to be a communist tho so fuck you
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713510555
rest in peace comrade
>>713521440
>>713522274
Thanks, Comrade.
>>713522274
So you're saying we're fed propoganda against Cuba yet our leaders in both Canada and the US talk them up. Meanwhile the Cuban Americans who tell horror stories about Cuba are just glitches in an otherwise successful system?
rest in peace comrade
Repost
>>713522274
"we'll fix it right or we'll fix it for free!"
Damn, you are stupid.
>>713510555
Castro started out good but went bad. Oh so bad.
>>713522778
did she shoot herself in the mouth
>>713522675
America is so anti communist they rather prop up dictators in South America then risk communism. Propaganda is not that much of a stretch. People may have fled Cuba because of some specific incidents they didn't agree with but in the Granf scheme of things Castro helped the country from its previous position.
>>713510555
I still think we can practice the kind of Communism Castro practiced.
>>713523102
Oh I won't argue with you there. Certainly there's propaganda. But we're talking about a country where people who are from there say it's shit and are celebrating his death in the streets. meanwhile there is a mandatory mourning period in cuba.
There's skepticism and then there's delusion.
>>713522274
The historical dimension is often ignored in these "captalism vs communism" debates.
Imperial Russia still had serfdom when the USA was already a major industrial power. Pre-revolution Russia was agrarian, illiterate and only notable for its oversized military power. In 20 years literacy and industrialisation skyrocketed under Soviet leadership.
>>713522675
We aren't fed propaganda against Cuba. The Western world doesn't hate other countries or even other people. A single person has no macro-effect on the world, and if the land is not in our borders, then that doesn't matter either. As such, it's easy to talk up a person that they don't care about, especially since he is recently dead.
The thing they don't like is the ideology. Communism and Socialism are ideologies for the majority of people, not the elite. It is in the best interest of a country like the US to make sure that Socialism does not become a strong ideological contender within our borders.
That's why legitimate, educated liberals (read: not SJWs) facepalm at the right so hard. (disclaimer: Socialism is incompatible with liberalism, so I by definition am not a liberal) They have been indoctrinated to believe in an ideology that works against their own best interest. I sit and watch as people go vote for Reagan, Bush, Bush again, Obama, and now Trump. But at the presidential level now, it's not even left-and-right. It's pro-corporation, pro-accumulation, pro-elite. Have you ever wondered why our politics are so narrow? Our biggest discussions are about abortion, the percentage of income that should be levied in taxes, minimum wages. We don't talk about real issues. We don't vote for real ideologies.
I'd best stop now or else this will become an essay.
>>713522836
The irony is real.
>>713523422
Yes, that's what I was saying in another post. Thanks, Comrade.
Also, nice trips.
>>713523447
Sorry, I should say, we are not fed propaganda against the country of Cuba, but the ideology it represents.
>>713523358
Not >>713523102 , but asking Cuban-Americans about Cuba is bound to result in extremely biased views. The core of the Cuban diaspora in America was formed by anti-Castro and anti-Communist Cubans, often bourgeois beneficiaries of the Batista reigime.
>>713523732
I'd say the opposite is true. The media and the government is saying castro was the bee's knees. Everything I know of him is the opposite. The only major player to come out and say Castro was evil (which former Cubans praised) was Trump, the change candidate who doesn't come from the establishment.
>>713523358
Assuming are in the streets partying is also wrong. I have a Cuban friend and he and his family don't care at all about what happened.
Of course they are going to "party" who's going to say publicly that they liked Castro? No media is going to except that because people see communism as evil no matter what the situation in America.
>>713524062
The funny thing about Trump is that he has fooled people into thinking that he is not from the establishment. Whereas politicians are generally supporting major corporations (hence, the establishment), he IS the major corporations. He's just as corrupt as the rest, but doesn't have to be so hush-hush about it. Want proof? Listen to the man speak.
>>713524001
lol once again anecdotal but the cubans I know were by no means rich or bored.
Certainly weren't after Castro fucked them.
>>713524062
I'm guessing you've never heard of Florida or Marco Rubio then.
>>713524207
this
>>713524383
HAHAHAHAHAH IT'S A MEME
You can stop now.
>>713524383
>2016
>people thinking that memes are actually correct and will change peoples' minds
>>713524062
As president you know trump is going to have to listen to the Republican Party now right? Nothing is going to pass unless he starts sucking some republican dick and doing as they say.
>>713524207
i believe you mean corporations and billionaires who own them support politicians but I see where you're coming from. That being said, the corruption exposed in trying to stop him makes me think he can be trusted.
Time will tell if I'm wrong but when the media and the government who I know are corrupt say he's "literally Hitler", I go the opposite way.
>>713511999
What like you can get underage hookers for food?
>>713524278
That's all well and fine but you won't get any semblance of a balanced view.
I reiterate; asking Cuban-Americans about Castro's Cuba is like going to a KKK meeting and asking them how they feel about blacks and jews.
>>713524568
Not necessarily. Even if he gets cucked he still has the power to shut down the stuff obama threw in without senate approval.
>>713510555
Rot in hell commie
>>713512677
leftist clueless hack
>>713524678
Well I can't ask regular old meat and potatoes Cubans and get an honest answer because if they say they hate it they'll get the gulag.
All I know is it's a totalitarian government. I'm not a fan of them and I'm not entirely convinced you'd have to be extremely wealthy to want to escape it.
Like I said, the mourning in Cuba is mandatory.
>>713524613
It's stupid to compare Trump to Hitler, as they are only alike in some manners that don't particularly matter.
He's not a fascist.
One of the main things I try to get across on /b/ is that there are smart people on the left, and on the right, and there are stupid people on the left, and the right. /b/ conflates Liberals with SJWs which is so wrong that it hurts to watch. Intelligent and educated liberals just get trolled by idiot conservatives (read: alt righters) who think that Jews rule the world and that personal experience trumps knowledge of history and philosophy.
At the same time, intelligent conservatives get drowned out by idiots with no background of political theory or economic philosophy. There is undeniably a tendency for liberals to be more educated and open to learning/implementing new ideas, which is also tough for decently intelligent conservatives to deal with.
So the intelligent conservatives are surrounded by uneducated buffoons, and intelligent liberals are surrounded by SJWs that think standpoint theory is a legitimate political ideology.
>>713515418
Says someone who probably was not around for the Berlin Wall, and does not remember bread lines in the Soviet Union. Also how about some of that Pol Pot improvements as well. That and China's even open Cultural Revolution.
>>713524711
What's the point of throwing the stuff out if your not going to replace it with something better? He can't fulfill his promises by complaining about Obama is whole time in office
>>713524891
>I'm not a fan of them and I'm not entirely convinced you'd have to be extremely wealthy to want to escape it.
Of course not. You don't have to be poor to be socialist, much like you don't have to be rich to be liberal (or libertarian as Americans like to say).
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/26/havana-mourning-cubans-fidelista-fidel-castro
Here's an article on the matter. It is the Guardian though.
I can't believe people still think communism is to be appraised. Communism only looks good on paper. In reality, everything belongs to people. This means a government authority can come to your house and fuck your wife, cause you don't own her, or take your sweet TV for the "nation's good". The only people who live well in a communist state are people who are in charge. Also, how would you feel knowing that your hypothetical lazy neighbor who lays a dick on work gets paid the same as you? Basically you will end up having to work harder to pay his salary.
>>713510555
Rest in Peace, comrade. I LOVE YOU, CASTRO! I HAD YOUR BABY!
>>713525301
You weren't around the the American genocide of the Iroquois, Sioux, Crow, and virtually every other Native American tribe from the east to the west coast. You weren't around for the times of slavery when it was considered morally acceptable to buy and sell humans. You weren't around when the United States rebelled from Britain about fucking taxes.
So tell me again from your moral high horse how any other powerful country is on a moral high ground?
>>713525206
Why do you think it is that colleges are so full of SJWs?
As an irredeemable member of the alt-right (which no one ever called themselves btw, speaking of propaganda). Anyway, I believe that there's an artificial movement created by people like Herb Sandler and Bill Gates to push "progressive" ideals in colleges via organizations like CAP.
These organizations are decidedly pro marxist and are obviously fully supported by the media and the government, who once again are praising the dead Castro.
So, as an educated person which you obviously are....what do you think of that?
>>713525773
Bill gates one of the richest men alive also lives in a America. You think he wants to push some form of communism?
>>713525768
But neither were you. But I was around for those days, and what sickens me is the leftist mindset that sees communism as a good thing, when in reality it is pure evil.
While yes this nation did have its faults we actually improved with age, as where communist nations are still repressive.
>>713510555
Rot in hell Commie POS !!!!
>>713526233
you ever heard of the horseshoe effect?
the more i look at the cuban situation, the more our own is reflected. difference being who controls the shitshow, but the shitshow's the same.
>>713526198
Of course, do you really think he'd be as poor as everyone else in a communist system? The elites would stay comfy where they are, they're building the global government afterall.
>>713525773
SJW-ism, if we want to call it that, is a deviation of left-wing politics, much like the alt-right is a deviation of right-wing politics. In both cases, they are defending an identity. They are both selfish and short-sighted movements that only detract from real issues in the world.
White nationalism and anti-semitism will not fix major problems, just as allowing gays to marry and accepting LGBTQIA members is not going to fix major problems.
One thing that I really want everyone in this thread to realize (so please read this and take it to heart) is that Marxism has been appropriated for dozens, if not hundreds of different movements and ideologies. It's hard to understand how this works if you have never read Marx in depth, but basically he promotes an idea called "historical materialism". Historical materialism is, essentially (though much more complex and nuanced), the scientific method applied to history. That's why he refers to Socialism as a science, and Capitalism as a feeling. You study the past, you study teleological and melioristic patterns from the dawn of history and from that make predictions about the future.
Marx is moreso known for, in academic circles, his critique of Capitalism, not his advocacy of Communism. Most academicians will tell you that he was a brilliant philosopher and economist (he was), but you'll hear over and over: "He was a great diagnostician, but his prescriptions were wrong". That part is debatable.
Onto my point, due to historical materialism, people have decided to take that idea and apply it to other things. This is called Cultural Marxism, and is what most right-wing supporters mean when they say Marxism. Cultural Marxism is a perversion of historical materialism, and is used in justifying anti-Communist and pro-Libertarian (market-wise) movements and ideologies.
So, in short, Marx's name holds incredible weight and respect in the intellectual realm, and movements will do whatever they can to get his name
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713526523
plastered all over it. When non-Communist movements say they are Marxist, think of it like a sticker on the windowshield of a new car that says "Proletariat tested, Marx approved!"
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713510555
>>713510555
rest in peace comrade
>>713510555
r e s t i n p e a c e c o m r a d e
>>713526523
People push the name "cultural marxism" on sjws, they don't fight for it.
In addition on behalf of the supposed alt-right which once again, doesn't exist as an organic entity, as in we didn't choose that monicker; anywho, we're not racist. We're not islamaphobic,mysogynists. We're nationalists. The fact that a lot of us are white is irrelevant as asside from those "nazis" that invited the media to watch them heil trump it's not about race.
The media made it about race to demonize the "alt-right"
>>713526523
Well put, but I'd like to say that "Cultural Marxism" is a reactionary red-herring term, only used to paint something in bad light.
>>713525773
The term Alt-Right was coined by one of its ideologues, can't remember who it was exactly. Also, unless those organisations campaign for the collective ownership of the means of production they are not marxist.
>>713526506
Proletarian revolutions usually end with the capitalists having their posessions reappropriated and the elite either dead or in exile.
Rest in peace comrade
Rest in Peace comrade
RIP comrade
>>713527181
I think Bill Gates, George Soros, etc etc honestly think they can make US communist, while retaining the wealth for themselves.
Afterall, going back to Cuba it's a Communist country but Castro and his family were rich as fuck.
>>713527144
>People push the name "cultural marxism" on sjws, they don't fight for it.
Maybe at some levels, but many sociopolitical writers turn to Marx to legitimize their work. Look at black-feminist writers Audre Lorde and bell hooks for example. These types of oppressed-group writers are the ones that fuel the ideology behind SJWs and their related movements.
Even if the average SJW has no idea what their written ideology is, if you trace back the intellectuals of the movement far enough, you'll find Marxism.
Rest in peace comrade
>>713527426
They are misguided from the very start; wealth cannot exist for individuals in Communism.
A Communist country has:
1) No monetary system
2) No classes
3) No State (this does not mean no government)
>>713527541
>Even if the average SJW has no idea what their written ideology is, if you trace back the intellectuals of the movement far enough, you'll find Marxism.
That's exactly what I think. I just think it's being pushed on them. That's why colleges are hotbeds for sjw issues. That's why Hillary got more support from people who had graduated college.
And I think it's totally artificial.
rest in peacе комрад
>>713527144
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1o6-bi3jlxk
How do you feel about this speech? Seems quite far from your conception of the 'alt-right'.
>>713527862
Yeah, those dickheads aren't exactly the common Trump supporter. Those are the guys who invited the media to film them throwing Nazi salutes to spook people about the alt-right imo.
>>713527806
I agree with you mostly. But we also must remember that there are likely dozens of factors that play into this.
As a Marxist-Leninist, any movement that is not ultimately about the abolition of class systems is an enemy to Communism. If you are more concerned with gay marriage, racial equality, or acceptance of otherkin, then you are only falling prey to bourgeoisie distractions. All equality issues are solved with the abolition of class.
>>713527996
Actually, fuck that.....it's not my opinion it's fact.
Even if they are white supremacists why would you advertise it so bluntly UNLESS you want people to be spooked. They're a physical manifestation of a straw man.
>>713528215
A few apples painted brown spoil the bunch.
This has happened to Communism as well. Stalin imprisons and kills dissidents who want to reignite the Civil War in the USSR, and suddenly Communism is pure evil.
The alt-right (for lack of a better term) will have to answer for its less-than-stellar members' actions.
>>713528125
Well I don't think they're genuine about wanting a classless society and I didn't mean to imply that they were. They want a system they control. Where the little guy never gets to climb up to their level. Worldwide if possible.
I think to do this they'll use identity politics and Islam to create massive discord.
I think it's going to fail no matter what though. It's like trying to convince people the sky is yellow. Even people that disagree with me about Trump must agree that you have SJWs to blame for Trump's popularity which I find hilarious.
>>713528417
Unless we can spread the word before the pain dries so to speak. I think the internet is a game changer on this. Old tactics are failing them.
>>713528125
Let me illustrate your point with a very relevant comic.
>>713527996
Of course they aren't the majority Trump support, but they are the hard core of it.
>>713527806
Or perhaps college-educated people were averse to voting for a reality-tv star with no political experience to the highest political office in the land. Highly educated people are also generally have more to gain from globalisation in terms of job opportunities abroad and cheaper consumer goods, whereas the working class faces competition from poorer countries.
>>713528613
The alt-right is a relatively new phenomenon, but everything I've experienced with them so far has been negative.
If you believe that markets should be free, then you'll never convert me, but I wouldn't mind discussing with you further so that I may understand it from the point of view of someone other than a poorly educated middle class white kid.
>>713510555
Rest in peace, Comrade.
>>713528861
>Of course they aren't the majority Trump support, but they are the hard core of it.
That's the media narrative, which I think is completely false.
>>713528861
Maybe, but I think it's pretty clear there's an orchestrated push. Ironically Saudi Arabia funds that push.
>>713528930
Well it's a lot of angry disenfranchised people who are constantly being told they're stupid and racist. They're not happy to be disagreed with and see enemies where there aren't any sometimes.
What if I told you I am that poorly educated white kid? Except I'm a little too old to be called a kid and I come from a poorer background.
>>713528861
That comic is brilliant. For a time, I participated in /r/Communism and /r/Communism101 thinking that I had found a haven for intellectual Marxists to discuss their ideas both with themselves and with newcomers.
Unfortunately, what I found were SJWs who had appropriated Marxism into their ideologies to push race equality, sexist equality, and the like - and they immediately ban anyone who speaks against that.
These people are not Communists or Socialists, they're Liberals who think that they are entitled to a free ride because they read The Communist Manifesto.
The ultimate irony for American liberals is that they turn into the same people that they seek to overcome. They want to overturn the patriarchy because they are oppressed by it, but seek to oppress it afterwards!
Anyways, thanks for the brilliant comic. For some people, memes and pictures are the only way to get through to them.
>>713529410
Then I would retort; if you ARE poorly educated and racist, then why would you get mad when people tell you that? It would be no different than calling a crow black.
>>713529567
Because I'm not racist and I'm tired of white guilt and the bigotry of low expectations(actual racism) overruling common sense. Especially at the cost of human liberty.
>>713510555
Rest In Peace comrade
>>713529773
I understand that. So let me ask you this; ifyou are poorly educated, why do you think that you have a firm understanding on reality, politics, and economics? You need to understand political philosophy and history to speak with any authority on politics.
The reason that liberals and conservatives have an intelligence gap (on average) is because those without education substitute personal experience for it. Watch any political debate on /b/. The right-wing debaters will speak with the assumption that experience trumps education and knowledge, while left-wingers (if they aren't just dumb SJWs) do the opposite.
Now, I'm not trying to antagonize you, but why not try and enlighten yourself before digging your heels into a political ideology?
>>713526523
>>713529473
>>713529953
this anon is awesome. i wish more people were like you on /b/
it's a fucking commie having CIVILIZED DEBATE with an alt-righter! this is a fucking first
>>713529953
Sorry, let me add:
If you do learn more about the world, and still find that this ideology suits you, then that's fine. But if you jump to the first thing you see or feel, then it is disingenuous for your own dignity not to look around more.
>>713529953
I don't have the time, money, or inclination to specialize in everything I have an opinion on. I do my best to be factual when discussing things, even when shitposting on /b/.
You have to admit, though, you're an anomaly. On /b/ and off, all sides are full of tards.
>>713530244
I'm almost 30 anon. I've been all over the map politically, spiritually, you name it. Every indication I see right now is that a corrupt establishment is trying to seize power via identity politics and dishonest reporting.
>>713510555
He tried.
>omg he killed rebels and dissidents
>not like our resplendent country, our hadnsd are clean
>lol
Eh, you win some, you lose some. The cubans that didn't like it, went to miami, and are happier in capitalist poverty rather than commie poverty.
bfd
>>713530091
this, I will miss smart commie anon when the thread dies. Nigga should start a youtube channel like styx and talk in a bathrobe or some shit.
>>713521440
every faggot in here is an american pseudo-intellectual bigot
there are russian migrants all around europe, western mostly. they flee their country because life there is really bad.
i once had a guy install my air conditioning in my house. this guy was a doctor. a fucking medical doctor. in any western country a doctor has a garanteed fat salary. he fled because some government workers killed his family right infront of him with a gun at point blank
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713530443
I'm right up there with you, and again, I mostly agree with you. I wrote a paper in grad school a few years ago about a personal theory of mine - that Libertarians are just under-educated Socialists. They generally want the same thing but don't have a linear knowledge of history to identify the overall problem.
So we both see a problem with this system, but I find that the issue lies in class warfare made possible by Capitalism (and hence, an economic problem) and you seem to see it more as a social problem.
>>713530091
>>713530793
Thanks guys. This is one of the few times that I don't just get trolled and called a pseudo-intellectual because I "use big words that don't mean anything".
BURN IN HELL, COMMIE
>>713510555
I sailed across to Cuba 2 years ago en route to bvi. Cuba was awesome. Warm wonderful people, beautiful old city with distinct architecture new and old, vibrant and busy streets full of music. Maybe the last place on earth not full of fucking american chain stores. Utterly lovely, even customs were easy and accommodating. Good people. Hope they don't throw everything they've managed to preserve out in the interest of easy american dollars, and end up with the worst of both worlds instead of the best, but I doubt they'd stand for it.
Funny thing, the Americans on here don't seem even remotely familiar with their southern neighboring countries whatsoever. Just that half a century ago they didn't like their choice in governments and tried to destroy them, and are bitter that it didn't work.
Is there anyone americans don't hate?
>>713531048
well, you're right, it couldn't happen in a "true communist" system. But was we've established in the shittier part of this thread, those don't exist and probably never will. Not unless we get some kind of computer to run the world to take away the temptations that power brings.
The social problems I see are undoubtedly created because of the economic problem of capitalism but without some magical mcguffin, capitalism is the worst system in the world except for all the others.
Rest in peace comrade
burn in hell commie scum
>>713511815
This nigger dont know shit, im cuban and i know this fucker did more good than bad.
Cabron
>>713531231
Didn't torture & kill anywhere near the number of civilians that any of the last 14 US presidents did.
Oh but it's good when we do it for political reasons, bad when others do it, right?
Bc we're the good guys, so if we do it, it's good.
/logic
>>713531231
BURN IN HELL COMMIE
>>713522978
hahahahaha...
rest in peace, comrade
>>713531477
Funny you should mention that - some Communists, since the Venus Project, are trying to solve Ludwig von Mises' Economic Calculus problem by using supercomputers. I wouldn't discount it entirely.
Most decent people will tell you that Communism is the best idea on paper. And yet, instead of doing what they can to make it happen, they wave it off with a hand and say "it can't ever happen, let's just stick with imperialism and exploitation of the masses by the elite"!
Thanks for the discussion. You are my honorary Comrade - a Comrade who shares with me in the suffering of the human condition.
>>713531048
Libertarianism simply leads to historical materialism. Marx wrote his theories of economy in the period of history where laissez-faire ruled. But I think the ideological divide is real, based on different conceptions of liberty - negative freedom (freedom to do whatever without impediment) and positive freedom (the opportunity to do things).
>>713530443
Let me then ask you, how do you think Trump's protectionism is going to be good to the US? You might bring some low-skilled work back to the country, but you'll also lose the rapidly expanding Chinese consumer market to sell to as well as suffer a massive increase in the cost of consumer goods.
rest in peace comrade
>>713531477
CERN's LHC runs like that. 10,000 scientists working and making nearly all decisions in a peer-to-peer array, being studied by anthropologists and sociologists from around the world.
Same way space stations work.
It's easier when these places are populated by the smartest people in the world, and not a bunch of overgrown apes grunting to fuck or kill everything that crosses their path.
Trash people, trash society, trash government.
>>713513420
>The last bearded Marxist have finally passed away
Castro was no more a communist than Atilla the Hun. What do you call a government system with a leader for life with leadership being passed to the next of heir?
Cuba is a monarchical tyrannical dictatorship, just like North Korea.
>>713530793
I've actually thought about doing a series on YouTube, but i'm sure other people already are doing it and better than I would.
Rest in peace comrade
>>713531784
>>713531477
>>713530793
a beautiful story comes to an end
why don't more debates on /b/ happen like this?
Told the his neighbor which just happened to be the most powerful country in the god dam world to fuck off and backed it up all of his living days. Got love the sheer audacity.
>>713532152
Thanks for building on my comment, Comrade.
>>713532299
Not enough communists. Dialectics is a beautiful thing.
>>713531784
I'd accept that Comrade smart anon. Now go start a channel or something you should be talking to people and spreading your knowledge.
Hey if someone figures out a way to take the human element out I don't think anyone would have a problem with free shit for everyone and we all sing koom bay ya around a campfire. I don't think it can happen right now and history shows it fails where it's tried.
>>713531811
As a factory worker, I'll take higher prices if it means there's more places to work. I think a lot of people forget how much lack of job competition hurts people.
I think iphones will cost more but we're alrady seeing Ford plants that would have gone to mexio staying put. That's going to be great for the economy, especially combined with tax cuts to expand the middle class, which I suppose is a dirty word in a commie thread but we need a stronger middle class.
Rest in Peace Commander Shepard
>>713532170
yup..my thoughts on it
Descansa en paz camarada!
>>713510555
After all these years, he has finally become a good communist.
>>713532299
Takes two to tango.
We all gotta come together and pow wow rather than call each other faggots.
Now don't' get me wrong I love calling people faggots but you don't' have to do it every time.
>inb4 I get called a faggot
>>713532299
I think it's because pride and ego gets in the way, even if the website is anonymous. Thanks to the particular branch of meritocracy that the West has cultivated, no longer are successes and failures an event that happens in our life, they are elements of our identity!
For instance, in some parts of the world, when a child fails a test, then it was an event that happened. They didn't study well enough or weren't prepared in general, and they failed. However, in our aggressive ladder-climbing meritocracy, that child didn't just FAIL A TEST, they ARE A FAILURE. This could also come about from pampering. If a child draws a picture and is told, "You painted a great picture", it is an extension of that child's action. If, however, you tell them that "You are a great artist!" it is now a part of their identity. From thereon, if they paint a bad picture, it was not anomalous, it was a part of their identity. They are now a bad artist.
Similarly, people who suffer from these same tendencies don't want to look like failures to other people or to themselves. No longer can we have a discussion where two people can walk away from it with either changed minds or in a peaceful agree-to-disagree-but-i-learned-alot mentality. It is a winner-takes-all knockdown dragout.
>>713532526
I can accept that. The only thing I ask of you now is to remember this conversation; if someone identifies themselves as a Communist, don't make assumptions until you hear what they have to say. Try to be openminded even if you know you will disagree from start to finish. We're all in this together.
>>713531231
burn in hell commie
>>713532981
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713532468
>>713532981
wow lol can someone who is better than me at computer screencap this discussion and pass it around on Best of /b/ threads?
who knows maybe it will even help our community to see a real debate take place lol
>>713517027
>Communism never works because people always do it wrong -- those guys just suck at doing Communism -- but THIS time, we'll get it right, no worries.
>>713533129
>For instance, in some parts of the world, when a child fails a test, then it was an event that happened. They didn't study well enough or weren't prepared in general, and they failed. However, in our aggressive ladder-climbing meritocracy, that child didn't just FAIL A TEST, they ARE A FAILURE. This could also come about from pampering. If a child draws a picture and is told, "You painted a great picture", it is an extension of that child's action. If, however, you tell them that "You are a great artist!" it is now a part of their identity. From thereon, if they paint a bad picture, it was not anomalous, it was a part of their identity. They are now a bad artist.
holy shit my mind is blown
that's genius
>>713533418
You're late to the party.
>>713510555
Rest in peace comrade
>>713517832
If USSR was what you cite as the most successful example, I'd say the argument is over and you lose.
>>713533472
The Communist Party?
>>713533599
Feel free to remain ignorant. This discussion is coming to an end. I'd suggest you read back through it.
>>713510555
>Comrade Castro
Rest in peace comrade Castro
Commie died on a capitalist day
I'm keking so hard
>>713517869
>Chinese economy
>Communism
Pick one.
China runs an emerging capitalist economy, allowing folks a chance to make a buck in exchange for not objecting to continued power and privilege for the governing class.
Prior to that change, the Chinese economy resembled that of North Korea -- not quite THAT bad, but not too far off.
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713519396
>The USSR had a competitive standard of living at the time.
If you believe that, you are woefully ignorant, however much you have studied, you have studied nonsense.
Come back to us.
>>713532179
Hey smart commie anon, before the thread dies you should probably do this. I think you'd be great at it.
Look to people like Sargon of Akkad and Styxhexenhammer666 for good examples of where I think you'd excel.
Which of course would make you part of a capitalistic meritocracy but whatever.
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713532526
The problem is that American wealth is built on the global economy these days. While America is the biggest national consumer market in the world for now and as such its economy can disproportionally rely on just its own consumption, the true source of national wealth is in global megacorporations such as Alphabet or Apple. Protectionism is going to hurt the economy as a whole. If the megacorps are forced to relocate their main business, it is going to devastate the American economy. Simple industry doesn't cut it anymore.
From the liberal (libertarian) point of view, it is a question of: "Why does an American worker deserve more compensation for the same work than a Chinese/Burmese/Indian worker?"
It is of course easy for me to say as one of those university-educated types (or to be), cheap workforce isn't threatening my economic security. But I haven't seen any good, rational arguments for economic or other nationalism.
>>713534156
Okay anon. I'm sure that you know much more than me, a person who has spent over 10 years studying political economy and lately focusing on 20th century Socialist countries.
I'm done here. You should read what I've posted elsewhere in the thread.
>>713534175
Thanks, anon. Maybe I will.
>>713533860
>>Chinese economy
>>Communism
>Pick one.
The Red Chinese have never been "communists." It has always been a totalitarian dictatorship by committee.
Their current economic model is just to absorb Western wealth due to ruling class capitalist greed to only expand their military.
Our Red Chinese overlords might have already beaten us.
>>713534569
B-but, they have sexy female jet pilots.
>>713523422
>Imperial Russia still had serfdom when the USA was already a major industrial power. Pre-revolution Russia was agrarian, illiterate and only notable for its oversized military power. In 20 years literacy and industrialisation skyrocketed under Soviet leadership.
And then stagnated and in many ays collapsd again.
But in the meantime, I suspect you have no data on what the Soviet Union would have been like had it bee, say, an American style Republic of willingly participatory states. Saying it got better after the Tsars at most says that the system under the Tsars sucked worse than the Soviet system. And even to make that claim, you have to claim to know ho the future would have unrolled under the Tsars. But you don't in fact know that.
>>713510555
Comrado castre
>>713534420
>Why does an American worker deserve more compensation for the same work than a Chinese/Burmese/Indian worker?
Because it costs more to live here than in China, Burma or India and if there are no jobs here, we instead get massive unemployment. With that we get unrest and crime.
Plus in my opinion as a drone that our quality is much higher than what you'll get from China, Burma, or India. Happy employees make good product and people in China for example are not happy, as evidenced by the suicide nets.
>>713533860
>>713534569
In order to make statements like these, it's important to note that the Daoist and Confucian ideals of Ancient China leading right up into the 20th century largely preclude their country from ever being "strictly capitalist", "strictly communist" or any given systematic variable.
China's history is predicated on social, moral and political flexibility. Whereas in, say, the USSR or some other country, Communism is the hard-and-fast rule, the teleological endgame, in China, it will bend and flex according to what is needed and necessary. If may be Communism in this century, it may not be. It may be a tweaked societal and economic system that looks like something but isn't quite.
To understand China, you have to understand its philosophy, and without that, you're left trying to fit a square peg in a ever-changing hole.
>>713524891
>I'm not entirely convinced you'd have to be extremely wealthy to want to escape it.
Constant stream of boat people refugees seems to bear you out. Not sure there were many Americans paddling their inner-tube rafts in a desperate attempt to get to Cuba.
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713534754
Not that anon, but actually, I can tell you based on what we know about political theory and history.
Capitalism must be predicated on a system of expansion, known as colonialism or imperialism, before it can succeed. The Russian Empire was not expanding the same way that the UK and US were at the time, and such a system would look nothing like what you would expect. Hell, coming from that angle, if the USSR adopted a Capitalist-Imperialistic model, we may all be speaking Russian right now.
But is that better for the human condition?
>>713534754
>>713535251
Also, the states of the USSR (with the exception of Georgia/Ukraine for petty reasons) were all willingly participatory. In the politburo's "constitution" of sorts, it was agreed that any province of the Soviet Union could secede at any time.
Rest in peace comrade.
>>713534156
>picks one point, the most subjective of them all, as the one point too argue on
typical /b/
>>713510555
Rest in Peace comrade
>>713533472
Sorry, couldn't get here until I got here.
>>713535527
If I may interject, due to the guy pictured that was not the reality, as illustrated by Hungary 1956 and Czechoslovakia 1968.
>>713534921
>the Daoist and Confucian ideals of Ancient China leading right up into the 20th century
Not sure where you got that cut-and-paste summery, but it's totally wrong.
The Taiping rebellion was the bloodiest revolution in history, and it was-- sort of-- Christian based.
To say that Red Chinese "communism" is "flexible" based on Daoist and Confucian ideals is fucking stupid.
Again, it's a totalitarian dictatorship by committee, and has nothing to do with communism except that their ruling class claims the title.
>>713536159
You're entitled to your opinion, anon. Cheers.
>>713536145
Smart Commie anon here.
If you'll kindly take note that Stalin died in 1953.
>>713533728
I read it to get down here and make that point. The economic system of the Soviet Union created horrible living conditions for so many people, technological stagnation and one of the world's premiere examples of a repressive state.
Yes, in the early years just coming out of the Tsarist era, conditions improved rapidly, before stagnating or falling back compared to western Europe.
How many people were shot trying to climb over the Berlin Wall into the glorious socialist paradise? How many poor Americans built crappy rafts and paddled towards the glorious island utopia Fidel built? Today, how many people are just dying to get into the socialist paradise in Venezuela?
>Once is just a fluke, twice is coincidence, three times means something.
>>713534903
American workers make more money than those of poorer countries even when measured by Purchasing Power Parity. They can afford far more luxury compared to their Chinese counterparts.
>if there are no jobs here, we instead get massive unemployment. With that we get unrest and crime.
Sounds like you support social policies that increase social mobility, such as free healthcare, social security and free education. This is the essential question to understand.
>>713536234
Look it up faggot, you'll see the truth.
Not much in Western history mentions the Taiping rebellion because it occurred during the American Civil War, but it's a huge piece of what Red China is today, and they claim the title of Communist only to suppress ALL religions. Look up Falun Gong, the other thing the can suppress the Chinese is an internal religious movement.
>>713536835
In economic theory, this is referred to as the "transition generation".
For any great economic change, the people alive during the change suffer. It's unavoidable. Mercantilism had one. Feudalism had one. Capitalism had one. Socialism had one.
And every country a major change happens in experiences this. In America, we've not experienced actual economic upheaval; but you can bet your ass when it happens that people will be paddling somewhere. It's about looking at the bigger picture, not just the last 100 years.
