How's this:
According to current calculations:
Hillary won the popular vote 47.8% to Trumps 47.3%
Trump won the electoral college and the election.
Hillary won California by 61.6% of the vote to Trump's 33.1%
If we remove California, then Trump won the rest of the country by 51.3% to Hillary's 48.7%.
So if you go by popular vote, you could say Hillary is the President of California and Trump is the President of the rest of the country.
The real question is do we want California or any other large state to decide the fate of the nation.
What would an election look like if we only used the popular vote? California and a few other states would decide it. The rest of the country? Oh Well!
So, all you liberals out there that have minority interests so dear to your hearts, what do you have to say?
And as to all this litigation: All you liberals who think that money should not influence the elective process, what do you say about someone with a wealthy foundation behind them trying to throw the election?
bump
The popular vote is an entirely pointless statistic as neither of the candidates campaigned for the popular vote. Their biggest presence was in swing states.
Ok well if you get rid of california you also get rid of the 5th largest economy in the world, so what shitty nation do you have left
>>713716378
California wants to secede. I say we should let them. Hillary can be their new president.
>>713716378
Instead we have hicks from backwater states deciding the fate of the people who actually matter.
>>713717181
the delusion
>>713717535
>tfw the rest of the US would fall into decay without CA.
the honest truth...the only reason trump was allowed to be president was to keep the anti-government, prejudice, ignorant, bigoted, ethnic nationalistic retards at bay and this was really the only way to do it. (moreover, remind them once again that when you want to act retarded it will ultimately hurt you and those around you while a small various segments benefit and laugh at your stupidity)
Obama was a lousy nigga
>>713717181
You mean that economy that goes bankrupt every couple years? The one that overly polices its citizens with legislation that only affects law abiding citizens, sometimes making them criminals overnight, and does nothing to keep the people they say they're targeting from committing the crimes they targeted? Yeah. Nothing of value would be lost.
>>713717623
No one matters.
>>713717625
Sorry, bud. Granted, California is the leading agricultural-producing state, but that can easily be replaced. Goodbye California. Don't come to the other 49 states when your freshwater supplies are fully depleted.
>>713718039
Also electricity. They buy the majority from outside of their state.
>>713717623
Sorry, bud. Not living in California does not qualify you as a hick.
>>713718107
wrong. they produce a ton of energy, gas, electric and oil. without this, the other 49 states would be paying astronomical prices for their energy.
>>713718107
Fuck California.
>>713716378
>The real question is do we want California or any other large state to decide the fate of the nation.
this is why we have the electrical collage.
>>713717181
The United States of America...
>>713718359
Wrong. They're 9th in energy production. Not equal to the amount of energy that they consume.
>>713718359
It's funny because California imports more electricity than any other state.
HEY! I'm hiding from the nigger hunters. Mind if I hide in this thread for awhile?
>>713716378
>reasoning that california's votes should not be included in the grand total
lol how do u evn democrac
popular vote had hilary first
EC had trump first
trump called the EC a sham, that it should be removed from the voting process
where does your flip-flopping president elect stand now?
Anyone wins with enough money. That's what trump taught the world
> Have lived in California
> Have lived in not-California
In any metric worth caring out, California is better.
Dozens of lawsuits were filed against delegates from the electoral college yesterday, in an effort to have them declare Hillary Clinton the winner.
This is not over yet. Democratic groups are really putting the pressure on the EC over the next couple of weeks. They will face years of litigation if they don't choose Hillary Clinton as the winner of the election.
>>713718675
No problem
>>713718952
>typical trump supporter
>>713718567
Nope. They are actually 11th place in production and consume 1/10th the power they produce.
>https://www.eia.gov/state/rankings/#/series/12
>>713718927
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>713719001
this.
they produce power for most of the western states, and produce gas and oil for nearly the entire country. people fail to realize that california is actually a bigger oil producer than texas.
>>713718883
>Anyone wins with enough money
If that were true Hillary would have won
>>713719119
>If that were true Hillary would have won
Exactly.
I saw somewhere the price per vote for both of them. It was stunning how much Hillary actually ended up spending per vote.
>>713716378
just make each state have 1 point and winner takes it so each state is equal value making swing states absolete
or make each state have a number of points and then divide them between candidates based of popular vote per state. so for example 10 points and clinton got 42% and trump got 51% and random guy got 7% then trump gets 5, clinton 4 rando 1.
>>713716378
Yes, if you remove 1/10 of the population of a country, it's gonna change a vote. I absolutely want my country decided by heavily populated areas. You know, where the people live. Fuck what PA and NH has to say, give me TX and FL in a cage match with CA and I'll be fine
>>713719280
she spent (not her personally but the whole campaign fund) close to 1 billion
forget how much trump spent but i think he actually ran one of the most cost effective campaigns ever spending as little as possible
>>713719280
Trump $4.84 per vote
Hillary $13.47 per vote
>>713719001
>>713719110
Wrong, and wrong. They bring in about a quarter of their total energy used from other states. 11th in production. Even a worse stat from my 9th. And the 1/10th is a made up statistic. To cite your own source:
http://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=4370
>>713717625
Yeah dude Cascadia+greater California would quickly turn to a mix of Fallout NV with "Do Androids Dream..."
>>713719458
Fucking this.
>>713719604
Hillary Clinton: $13.97 per vote
http://presidential-candidates.insidegov.com/stories/16360/how-much-candidate-spend-per-vote#13-Hillary-Clinton-13-97-per-vote
Donald Trump: $5.19 per vote
http://presidential-candidates.insidegov.com/stories/16360/how-much-candidate-spend-per-vote#15-Donald-Trump-5-19-per-vote
>>713719386
We already have a system like that. It's called the electoral college.
>>713719458
You say you care about heavily populated areas. You say fuck Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania is the 6th most populated state. Please, revisit your logic before speaking. Fuck.
>>713716378
>Hillary won the popular vote 47.8% to Trumps 47.3%
Only if you pretend illegal immigrants don't exist.
At least 3 million of them voted, mostly in places like California where it's not legal but not discouraged.
As far as the electoral college, it's there to prevent mobs of retards ruling the country aka California. It worked exactly as it was intended to work.
>>713719386
>>713719713
Refer to
>>713719804
>>713716378
>The real question is do we want California or any other large state to decide the fate of the nation
this is exactly what the EC does, getting rid of it makes every vote count the same
2/10 for making me reply
>>713719797
that's not why we have the EC. the EC was designed to keep certain people out of the office of president. this is exactly why HRC will be declared the winner.
>>713719805
Proof?
>>713719797
which many people find unfair since you have places like california who equal a dozen other states. if they want it to be fair make all states equal. but then same people complaining about current system would still bitch and cry since it would mean they cant win a few states and overpower many others
>>713719925
the EC was designed in the 1700s it wasnt made for hillary or trump
its just a pain to change the constitution and it rarely affects elections so we havent done anything about it
>>713719925
Keep telling yourself that kiddo. It was created to give every state a say in who gets elected.
>>713716650
/thread
2019 CALEXIT
>>713718927
Bait be damned, Trump won fair and square. You may not like it, but it happened. Deal with it.
>>713720156
every PERSON has a say why would what state they live in matter? Why should a vote in ohio matter more than one in texas or newyork?
>>713716378
California is a part of the Union, not sure whats the purpose of excluding them from your popular vote count. People in California's opinion matter less than your opinion...because you disagree with prevailing opinion there...sounds rather convenient.
Makes sense to me that the will of the people should decide the election. And that some votes shouldnt 'count' more than others. I think our electoral system is flawed, exactly because it promotes campaigning in only swing states. Why should the issues facing those swing states be more important than the issues the country at large faces? It is purely an artifact that those states get the most attention from campaigning presidential nominees - that is surely not what our founding fathers intended.
That said, rules is rules. They are what they are until they are changed and I respect the results that come out of them. I do think we should change them tho for the reasons stated above.
>>713720001
Some guy who does data analysis for medical insurance companies pointed it out. But we all knew it was going to happen, Obama even said illegal immigrants couldn't be punished in any way for voting.
at least we can all agree on yeezy 2020
>>713718927
How are those recounts going?
Wisconsin actually found errors that originally cheated Trump out of some votes. They have since corrected that, so Trump now has a bigger lead there so far...
>>713716650
>implying "campaigning" does anything
people are set in their opinions. If you arent pissed off enough to vote seeing a comerical or that a rally is in your area isnt going to sway you in any way
>>713720392
>so far
Until they start throwing out the bad votes uploaded by the Russians. Then we'll see how Trump's doing.
>>713716378
libtards dont know shit about the election system.
the founding fathers created this type of election system to avoid a tyranny of the majority and to have a better democratic system than europe. these men had some serious knowledge.
>>713720299
They're probably lobotomising him right now so I doubt it.
After he revealed his power level at that show they brought him to the hospital in handcuffs and canceled his tour.
>>713720532
Even Obama himself has come out and said the administration has no credible evidence that the vote was "hacked".
>>713718675
Hunters that hunt niggers or hunters that are niggers?
>>713720563
In what way does it address that at all? Like gerrymandering, it simply puts more weight on close victories than landslides
>>713716378
you're point is void because trump won and it proves big states don't decide elections. California stays.
>>713716378
Your logic is a mess bud. If youre trying to ignore the electoral college, and just go by popular vote, why are you immediately falling back on arbitrary delineations like state lines? They would also be pointless. Even in California 1 out of 3 voted for Trump. Your false dichotomy straw man is showing.
Whats the point of this thread? If we stopped counting electoral votes the way we are now, and started doing it some other weird way that would suck? Or do you just not understand that a straight popular vote count is unweighted, and then there is no point to whining about populous states vs unpopular? Or are you just so blind to your own brainwashing you just want a thread to demonstrate your fear of democracy, your poor grasp of politics and your inability to understand basic math?
>>713719119
1.3 billion
that cant be real
so much fucking money.
for what did she spent all that cash?
>>713720777
Trips of salty truth.
DAK DAR DAK HILLARY BILLTON TOOK DUR MONEY FROM THE ARABIANS TO SUPPORT ISIS IN THE GADDAFI CRYING FROM GOLDEN TOILET TO SEWER DRAG
>>713720090
the electoral college absolutely affects elections you idiot. just like polls do. most morons just vote for who they think is the frontrunner. get a clue dolt.
>>713719677
First, nice of you to pick a 6 year old data point. Second, they only import 1/4 of their total electricity. In oil, natural gas, biomass and other fuels they far out wiegh any other western state. Those fuels go out to other states to burn and come back to California as liw cost electricity.
https://www.eia.gov/state/analysis.cfm?sid=CA
And my stats were incorrect. They consume 196 Million btus of energy (per capita) and export 2413 Trillion btus. So its closer to 1/12 total production.
>>713720566
my mans cancelled his own shit and got admitted on account of some temporary psychosis endgendered by a combination of stress, sleep deprivation, and dehydration
it wasn't political just ye being ye. kimd never let em cauterize mans brain
anyway he aint revealed nun we aint already known for a decade lmao kanye is the greatest of all time what else is new
>>713720491
>being this retarded
>>713720708
It let's the non-population centers have a more fair say in the election. Just because a large group all live in one or two areas, doesn't mean that, that group specifically understands the problems from the remaining groups.
It's actually quite brilliant.
>>713720708
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6s7jB6-GoU
>>713720815
Ctr shills and pizza
the end is near, we are all going to die the end is nigh this parallel is doomed everybody THE END IS COMING
>>713720563
Its pretty well documented that the founding fathers were looking to prevent unqualified populist candidates from taking office when they installed the EC. It was a layer of insulation between the popular vote and the presidency.
Also important, it was meant as a compromise to assure that the less populated southern states would have a better shot at the presidency as to promote some equity of power between the North and South. That dynamic is largely dead...but I understand the argument about having less populous states having their say as well....I just don't agree with it. One man one vote makes the most sense to me from a fairness perspective.
>>713720815
Shill army, giant 150" uhd tvs she broke after she lost, a huge spcial effects glass ceiling, a massive fireworks show, celebrity endorsement, probably a bunch of bribes.
I believe it, she got at least 25 million just from Saudi Arabia.
isnt it a bit silly to say that california and a few other states would make the decision? i mean the individuals in the state would give the votes, 1 for each right? i doubt any state is politically homogeneous. and isnt it just as unfair" that a state with 40k inhabitans has the same political power as one with 1 mil (not real numbers obv)?
ps. not american and basically politically retarded, just have questions.
>>713720951
Yeah he cancelled his own tour.
From the hospital.
In handcuffs.
>>713720815
Mostly paying shills/protesters and running ads to slander Trump
>>713720299
>Trump can't be president, he's never held political office! He's not qualified!
>Let's elect a rapper instead
>>713716378
The Electoral College doesn't protect small states in the way you are thinking it does.
I'm not taking a position I'm just saying. If anyone would like to know more CGP did a pretty good job explaining it on his youtube.
>>713719119
>everyone expected her to win
Not everyone. Some people don't watch fake news.
>>713716378
you delusional fagets.
according to current calculation, #PizzaGate pedophiles Comet Ping Pong podesta pedo-ring
America, why u no direct elect?
Why put middlemen in your democratic process?
Why deal with muh popular vote / muh electoral college questions?
Srs question from Europe.
>>713720958
>problem affecting millions of people
>problem affecting a few thousand people
Lets set equal priorities on those right?
>>713721121
she wasted money fighting trump in a way that made him stronger and never realized it. but hey i made 10k this election by being one of those "violent" trump supporters so i'm kinda happy she did use so much money
>>713716378
Another know-nothing idiot spreading know-nothing bullshit.
California is the 7th largest economy IN THE WORLD. California contributes TWICE as much to the overall US economy (13.3%) as Texas (the next largest of the US state economies).
So were you to "remove California", you'd be fucked!
>>713716378
this entire "RECOUNT THE VOTES HURRDURR"
was started by jill stein to make money for her and only for her
>>713720280
Because All the states have different interests, and many of those interests would be deemed irrelevant because of population density.
>>713721136
Kanye's a downlow Trump supporter who tried to turn part of his fanbase against the establishment so they took him in chains to a mental hospital and cancelled his tour.
He's probably too dumb to be a President but I'd vote for him over any globalist.
>>713721342
>So were you to "remove California", you'd be fucked!
Not as much as California would be.
>no military
>no water
>lazy, entitled sjws instead of men and women
They'd die without us, you can't buy a new iphone when you're dead.
>>713721344
Soros has funded the recount effort. He is going to do anything he can to get Hillary in. By no means is he done yet....
>>713720291
Suuuuuure, bud
>>713721580
Anon, those states have pushed to make illegal immigrants voting legal.
In addition, many of these same states don't require you show your driver's liscense or any other id when you vote.
If you don't think illegal immigrants voted you're a silly person.
>>713721281
Democrats do exactly that all the fucking time. Most people will never meet a tranny yet they focus on tranny bullshit instead of real issues.
"the office of president will never fall to the lot of any man who is not in an eminent degree endowed with the requisite qualifications"
-Alexander Hamilton on the EC
We really fucked that one up, huh...
>>713720933
Data point is still relevant. I said 1/4, which is equal to a quarter. What the fuck are you talking about? They consume 7,620 TRILLION BTUs.
http://www.eia.gov/state/data.cfm?sid=CA
http://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=CA#tabs-3
First link is for consumption. Second link is for production. Just stop. You're arguing against numbers and statistic given by the government. It is okay to be wrong sometimes.
>>713721580
>>713721651
im an illegal and have voted in 2 elections. last election someone did contact authorities about illegals but was told to fuck off basically.
>>713720962
I know how it works dumbass, all this bimbo is saying is that candidates have to shill to rednecks to win.
How is that good for the country? The college transfers the importance of capaigning in cities to swing states and actually create a "tyranny of the minority". The minority of voters in swing state decide elections and everyone else's vote is meaninless
>>713721697
That's all a big smoke screen because they can't talk about their real issues, as they are complete failures.
>>713721487
Ha!! You would be buying your oil and electricity and most of your food from California.
>>713721752
In your wrong opinion yes.
Meanwhile Trump is already working to keep jobs in America and succeeding.
He's not even the president yet and he's got Ford and Carrier keeping their operations in the USA.
He also took us from the brink of WW3 to peace just by winning.
In short, Trump is pretty great at this so far.
>>713721378
kanye isn't a trump supporter. if he was, he would've voted for trump. he just respects trump immensely more than clinton and he's glad we're getting change no matter what that change is because ye is ye and ye is into "paradigm shifts"
i don't know who "they" is in your sick ass narrative where liberals control the establishment and all dissent is silenced. if that were the case kanye would speak out against it directly with all the paranoid shit hes been spouting. he wasnt admitted for any political reason, he was admitted because he's mentally ill and he had a psychotic break
and if you think hes dumb youve never heard him speak. ye may be pervasively oblivious but i guarantee his iq is higher than yours
>>713721697
appealing to emotion is a political tactic both sides use
most people will never meet an illegal immigrant but states like ohio and michigan are so butthurt about mexicans taking fast food jobs in arizona it they vote republican while on welfare
>>713721894
>no military
>would have to go to war to secede
No, we wouldn't buy it. We'd just take it from you like we did in the middle-east.
>>713721803
Its not like the fucking wires would be cut if california left the union. Power is traded across Europe....and we already trade power with Canada. You have a dumb argument there. And California also has its share of military bases. They would be absolutely fine on their own, they already give more taxes to federal government than the federal benefits they receive, see pic related.
>>713721873
Shut up with your bullshit nigger
>>713716378
it would be nice if the damned san andreas fault would do it's job and dumb that worthless state into the ocean
>>713716378
You do realise what that trend means for you though? As the population of California increases, so will its count of electoral college votes, and those sections of the US are growing more liberal and higher in popularion than middle America.
It may not bother you now, but 50 years from now you actually MAY have a country where votes from NY, Cal, TX and Florida are almost enough to carry you.
>>713720491
some people actually care about politics and don't make snap judgement based on what our highschool teachers tell us to think.
>>713721487
lot of trump states at the top there...
>>713716378
Imagine what a nightmare a recount would be if we used the popular vote.
>>713722190
colombian actually
>>713721894
Seeing as they have to import most of their water since they're in a constant state of drought they wouldn't be growing anything.
>>713722035
"I'm on my Trump shit"
"the radio is going to be Hillary Clintoned"
"I'm not going to lie to you like Mark Zuckerberg and Google whey they told you Hillary would win"
sounds like a redpilled Trump supporter to me.
As for who "they" are. They're the globalist establishment. Same people who run the media and colleges. You don't think they keep a big time celebrity like Kanye in line when he doesn't mesh with their narrative and tries to turn his fans against them even momentarily?
"I'm risking my life to tell you the truth"
I've heard him speak obviously, I just don't think he has the right experience to be a president.
>>713721954
Ford was a big nothing, they weren't leaving in the first place.
And Carrier was a big show...more of Pence's win as a governor (by offering state incentives)...I wouldnt be surprised if that was decided/negotiated 6 months ago only to be announced now to make Trump look good. He is quite a showman. That siad, great, I'm glad those jobs are staying. Now if Trump can do that a couple hundred more times, he will have lived up to Obama's legacy on job growth.
Lastly, I see you've been gobbling up that Russian propaganda quite nicely. Get Putin's dick out of your mouth, dude.
>>713722409
>Ford was a big nothing, they weren't leaving in the first place.
Yes they were, they had plans to go to mexico. A ford spokeswoman said so.
Nice projection on gobbling up propaganda though.
>>713722259
If you care about politics you are opinionated
I have never met someone that is interested in politics and doesnt have a stance on one of the major issues
>>713720280
Why would a vote in Ohio mean less? CA has been overrun with an invasion from a foreign country, this is the tyranny that our founding fathers meant when they formed the electoral college. That at the time the populated area would not decide for the whole country. The electoral college is the will of the people of the collective that is the UNITED states. Not the united state of california or united state of NY only, get over it.
>>713721894
yea, we would be so fucked without avocados, almonds, and grapes
>>713720090
One of the ***original*** arguments for the EC was that, by electing electors, you were electing people who would put some thought into it, and would be able to thwart a loud-mouthed demagogue from taking power, a definite downfall of historical democracies past.
This concept didn't survive the early 1800s, or failed more accurately, but it was literally part of the rationale.
Having said that, it would probably be stupid to attempt to throw it to Hillary this way.
>>713722102
This is besides the point. This is not what we were arguing. Nice fallback, though. I was going to use the same argument if I found my numbers were wrong. Literally, I was going to say that all countries export and import shit like energy. California would be the loser if they seceded, though.
>>713722299
Yeah, the Trumpanzees never stop whining about the cities and coastal blue states receiving all the benefits....they have it totally backwards. Misguided retards
>>713721697
>Not an argument for why the EC shouldn't be abolished
>>713718883
Her campaign was much more, tard
>>713722659
I'm not the same guy you were arguing with...was just saying that whether a state is a net importer or exporter of energy production is a retarded way to measure thats states success. Its not like they couldnt build more energy infrastructure...whats the fucking point of this energy argument?
>>713716378
Count it by the counties. And then you'll understand.
>>713721894
We'd boycott ca and buy from Canada
>>713722513
Y'all are taking this shit with too much sugar. He saved .. maybe 1000, less than half, the Carrier jobs, more than half still going to Mexico. Ford is probably doing the same. I mean, I'll give them some credit for helping out a handful of families, but what do you expect them to do, offer incentives per business? There ia already another manufacturer just down the road from Carrier that is off to Mexico, no deal there... its just showboating and creates a dangerous precedent, companies may threaten to move knowing Trump will be almost obliged to offer free shit just to make them stay. This is why a smart Federal government makes broad offers that benefit all and exclude none. You may be impressed with Carrier, but he can't do that to every individual company and manufacturing is still hemorrhaging workers.
>>713722878
The guy I was arguing with originally stated that the rest of the 49 states would be fucked energy-wise. I set out to prove that wrong, that in fact the other 49 state would be fine without California's agriculture and energy.
>>713718883
>>713721954
Do people not know why africa and south america are so shitty?
Its because they nationalize businesses and put up tariffs to protect their shitty domestic industries that they dont have competitive advantages for. Everyone in the country has to pay higher prices and have shittier products
Conservatives for DECADES have been trying to get people to understand that free trade is good on average for a country in EVERY scenario. It would be cheaper to put every auto and steel worker on welfare than it would be to create a tariff high enough to keep them employed in a dying and inefficient industry. But because people get butthurt over people not working we keep doing the wrong thing and hurting the country
Ive never seen a party get cucked on an issue so hard before, I feel bad for the republicans in congress that are gonna get hell when they reject all trumps trade policies
>>713722382
the whole kanye/trump thing is complicated
"Obama couldn’t make America great because he couldn’t be him to be who he was. Black men have been slaves. Obama wasn’t allowed to do this [screams] and still win. He had to be perfect. But being perfect don’t always change shit, bro. Being perfect don’t always change shit, bro."
"It’s a new world, Hillary Clinton, it’s a new world. Feelings matter. Because guess what? Everybody in middle America felt a way and they showed you how they felt. Feelings matter, bro."
>>713720815
Paying ppl to attack Trump supporters, interupt his rallies and commit fake hate crimes like that black church that burned down with "vote trump" spray painted on it.
>>713723017
We actually don't know how he got them to stay, just that he did.
Now you're right that IF he gave them free shit to stay it's useless.
I don't think he did. I think he gave them a friendly reminder that if they leave they're going to be taxed heavily when they import.
Don't forget, he's not even the president yet and he's handling these matters like a g. Most politicians would be playing golf right now but he's working on fucking thanksgiving to get shit done.
>>713723024
Its fairly clear to me that both California and the remaining USA would both lose if California left.
California has amazing tech and media centers, two industries not threatened by automation or outsourcing the same way much of the rest of our economy is. Meanwhile, an independent California would have to spend lots of $$$ duplicating services that are already provided, most importantly defense and government.
Its stupid for them to succeed...it is against almost everyone's interests...
Yeah. Let's make it a popular vote. Let's advertise that it's 1 person 1 vote. Let's get those republicans in blue populous zones excited about voting again. The red voters don't gaf about voting when your state is gonna go blue regardless. So let's give everyone equal say. Watch who's party comes out in full force and who comes out in a marginally larger amount. If dems couldn't be fucked to try and stop trump and reps came out in full force now just watch what happens with a popular vote decision.
>>713717181
Califag detected
No one cares about your shitty desert state
>>713721319
Bullshit.txt
You made 10k giving nickel blowjons to other safe space Hillary cucks
>>713723120
>Its because they nationalize businesses and put up tariffs to protect their shitty domestic industries that they dont have competitive advantages for. Everyone in the country has to pay higher prices and have shittier products
No. No its not this.
Africa is shitty becasue its full Africans. What is so hard to understand about this? Africans are a sub-human species. They are not capable of any real accomplishments. Africans only chance of survival is what the White and Yellow man gives him.
>>713723336
oops secede, not succeed
>>713718039
>agricultural producing state
>Using water that isn't even yours
>probably talking about leading in growing pot
>>713721752
True, Obama twice was retarded
>>713722676
Except the elites lording over the country, earning trillions while shipping red states' jobs overseas, cluster in those giant coastal cities, propping them up by taxes made crushing the rest of the country.
>>713723474
>respond to proven economics with generic racism
trumps campaign summed up
>>713723029
Not accepting a result is one thing. Not accepting a result with 'anomalies' is another. Especially in light of security people pointing out how easy it would be to hack the results.
>>713722035
I'm a 12yr old wigger, the post
>>713717930
Ironic how you ignore counties. I was raised in Cali, and my dad worked for our county as a public defender. There was a lot of money to go around, and a lot on savings, despite the state's inability to properly budget. He makes more in retirement than he did working, which still blows my mind.
Now, I know what you must be thinking, it must be one of those northern counties that didn't deal with immigrant filth. Nope. It was San Diego.
>>713723373
Kek. You're not wrong.
>>713723768
Yeah but then the administration came out and said that there was absolutely no evidence of "hacking" the election. Obama himself said that on national television.
>>713723716
We are not sending any jobs oversees. Those jobs are drying up because the world is changing my friend. Automation accounts for 3-8x as many lost manufacturing jobs as outsourcing. BUt the reason both occur is because Americans are so much richer than workers in other countries, we can no longer employ American workers to do labor intensive work and still be competitive. Keep pushing for going back to the 20th century and we will cease leading the world in the 21st century....
>>713723474
mommy must have dated a black guy you didnt like huh?
>>713719110
>people fail to realize that california is actually a bigger oil producer than texas
Wrong. Texas is the largest oil producer followed by ND and AK. California is 4th largest.
>>713723336
I understand both states would lose out. I only say California would lose out more because of the impending doom that is looming over California. Primarily, the lack of and depleting of fresh water. Secondarily, overpopulation becomes an issue at some point.
I say we drop Cali and make Puerto Rico the new 50th state.
>>713723718
Not really and he makes a valid point. What doesn't work for Africa might work for the USA. Afterall we make good quality shit, I should know I work in one of the last successful steel factories in America.
If Trump gets in, we're probably going to double or triple our size because our only competition is huge companies that ship all their labor out to china and mexico and make inferior junk they sell at lower prices.
>>713723981
So you're okay with companies paying slave wages just to stay competitive?
>>713720280
there vote doesn't matter 'more' why do people think this?
>>713723981
this
for the same reason we bought up excess crops to help small farmers and just let them rot in silos for years, we are now propping up dying industries and costing the country billions
>>713723943
Not that other anon...I agree that that there doesnt appear to be any evidence of tampering. BUt who the fuck cares, after all the shit that went down this election cycle between Trump claiming rigged elections and government agencies claiming interference from Russia, and computer science experts saying hacking of the voting machines is possible.... lets make sure nothing fucked up is going on here....why the fuck not?
>>713720815
I got about a 100 shills for my efforts.
>>713723253
I'll give em credit for that, still working and making any deal, regardless of size DOES look good for a bulletin point.
Having said that, I imagine that most companies are aware of import taxes, but if most of then manufacture for overseas markets, then its probably a minor thing. He will end up with a lot of other familes wondering where their deal went to, and my concern is that, while it seems positive now, it is unfeasible to keep that up on a per company basis, and many manufacturers aren't shipping workers to international markets, they are just losing workers and the rust belt has almost no backup plan.
>>713724195
100 schillings....
kek
>>713723643
You stupid? I'm on your side. I think California would be doomed without us. Enhance your reading comprehension skills.
>>713724094
if people in other countries have better technology or low wages (the case in just about every country in the world) it makes no sense to make something here that can be made cheaper somewhere else
As I said in a previous post, its cheaper on the whole to pay for unemployment, job retraining and possibly welfare for workers that are being outsourced than it is to make everyone buy products at a higher price just for the sake of a few workers
>>713724121
I'm a capitalist, I'm OK with companies doing what they need to do to stay competitive.
I'm also all for equality of opportunity and believe that we need to look after workers who have been displaced (which the government has failed to do - both left and right wingers). But we shouldnt shoot ourselves in the foot by pushing policy that protects a small amount of manufacturing jobs at the expense of the rest of its citizens. Free trade has not resulted in the decimation of our manufacturing sector as Trump and Bernie would have you believe. It has thrived...just doesnt employ so many people as it used to (pic related). Meanwhile, we all enjoy lower cost imports due to free trade, and our exports have increased as well.
>>713717535
Please no. It's already so cucked out here and it would only get worse from there
>>713724265
idk about that bro, I see a lot of factories locally close up shop and move to mexico or whereever for cheaper labor.
Plus as I said in another post I work in a factory making American goods. We're like 2% of the market, small local place and our biggest competitor uses cheap international labor exclusively.
If they go down for a year we'll grow so fast I'm not sure we can handle it.
I know that's just one company but I expect many others are in the same boat.
>>713724445
No, it's cheaper to lift the dumb regulations that have allowed that to happen, and update our facilities Foreign facilities are better because they're more modern than or old shit that dates back to the 70s at the newest. Government regulations have strangled building newer and more modernized facilities. Getting rid of that bullshit, and modernizing will not only put many people back to work, but in the end make it cheaper to manufacture here in the states.
>>713721268
look at this:
>>713720962
>>713724445
They don't, their tech is shit.
I know a guy who had to go to mexico to get a plant started. It was a disaster. Quality went to shit, the people there weren't listening to him, but they stil did it because it was cheaper.
In short the way it is now you pay more for junk when you could have had good quality product and given more than "welfare" to people.
I think we the people deserve more than welfare.
>>713724628
be specific
name one specific regulation that is partly responsible for this
I hear this all the time "reuglation is killing business" blah blah blah
the competative advantage china and mexico have is their low wages
manufacturing is poverty work. Get an education and an office job
>>713724792
They also have suicide nets put up around their plants.
Happy workers make better product. They're more attentive to quality.
Plus China doesn't give a fuck about quality in general. They sell fake eggs and plastic rice ffs.
>>713724176
Because it's so blatantly obvious that there isn't any Trump fuckery that Hillary, Obama, and everyone else that actually has a stake in the game have accepted the results. It's only retards, niggers, and Jill stein that aren't.
>>713724792
Steel mills. There's one of many. Oil refineries, and general industrial manufacturing facilities are kept out. The permit application process is a nightmare.
The EPA is the number one culprit. They can simply make regulations as they go. No input from congress or the president needed. They need to be defunded and rules should be passed as laws through congress just like everything else.
>>713717625
>California and their 55 electoral votes succeed from the Union
>dems never win another election for the rest of history
>Donald Trump is elected God President for life
>eternal left lib dem butthurt
buh-bye
>>713724770
if people wanted "quality american products" they would buy them. They, like trump, prefer the cheaper option
the market has spoken and at wages demanded by american workers, manufacturing is not the future of america
The service and high tech industires are booming, and more people have degrees than ever before
>>713718479
Welcome to the SSA, segregated states of america
>>713724961
I want to see if something fucked up happened. Didnt need to come from Trump's crew to be unacceptable. Any tampering is unacceptable. I'd like to know that all the voting in this country is absolutely on the up and up after all the venom spewed in this election. The concept of fair elections in the USA has been attacked, both by Trump and the Russians. I have lost a lot of faith in our elections being fair and I would like that faith to be restored.
>>713725034
>hey guys lets destroy the planet cleetus over here can have a job where he doesnt need to read
>>713725048
Actually most people don't get the chance.
The market is saturated with cheap knockoffs made by suicidal chinese workers. You have to really dig for the good stuff which you're right, most people are unwilling to do.
But people would absolutely spend more for quality if they had the option readily available. Otherwise, everybody would just buy off brand food and pepsi/kraft/what have you would be out of business.
Don't forget, his policies not only improve our goods they also don't support countries like China that kill more of their own people than Hitler ever did.
So even if you're not into having nice shit and making your fellow americans happy, think of the people from other countries currently being exploited. Do you want to support that? I don't.
Especially when the alternative is everyone working in other fields and buying trash made by unhappy people that we have to constantly replace.
>>713725459
aren't willing to do*
>>713725459
not that other guy, but I'm sure the workers in China that have the 'good jobs' that you want back absolutely appreciate their jobs and wouldnt be working there if they had better options.
And last time I checked, America turns out a fairly shitty product a lot of the time. Most of our cars suck, for instance, Asian made cars are more reliable and Euro made cars are better performing. This meme that America makes only the highest quality goods is not founded on the facts
>>713725189
Not what was said. China and India are building manufacturing facilities, so if we want to compete, we need to as well. It doesn't mean trashing the environment. In fact it means saving it. If we compete, we slow down their manufacturing to some degree. They have very shitty environmental regulations, so by doing this we are actually helping the planet, instead of just letting them do it all.
The EPA should not simply be allowed to make rules unchecked. They should have to go through a process, and not simply just become a rule because "they said so".
>>713721580
Obama did an interview a few days before the election urging illegals to get out there and vote Hillary
>>713725715
>not simply just become a rule because "they said so"
That's how it was setup. Deal with it.
>>713725704
lol you don't know much about china and it's workers do you?
They live there in bunkhouses and are forced to work. There are nets around the buildings to prevent suicide which is endmic. Plus do you think China has something similar to OSHA, nope.
>>713716378
This is so fucking retarded.
What would happen if we removed the state that Trump got the most votes in from the vote? He would still have lost the popular vote which means that he wouldn't be the president of the rest of the country.
The real question is if we want (state that trump won most votes in) to affect the fate of the nation.
This is just an exercise in what-ifs by the OP. Let's randomly remove a state and then speculate why the rest of the country with all its vote patterns should be allowed to stay.
>>713725956
You don't know much about American industry 100 years ago, do you? Workers (often children) lived in boarding houses and often committed suicide. They didnt have OSHA.
This is the cost of industrialization. It sucks, but its better than living in a farming based economy that can barely provide food for its citizens...
>>713722363
Exactly
>>713726279
It's not 100 years ago though.
If they'd stop fucking over American businesses we wouldn't be so reliant on human suffering.
>>713718039
anon... if you look on a map... whats west of california?
THE FUCKING PACIFIC OCEAN
filtrate fucking salt and bacteria out of the water and what do you have... drinkable water
inb4 "you cant turn ocean water into drinking water"
protip: you can
>>713726783
They literally can't. Not on a grand enough scale to provide them with drinking water for everyone. Too many fucking people.
>>713726445
>its not 100 years ago tho
Yes, here in the USA, we can afford all those worker protections. But China can't, just like we couldnt 100 years ago. I dont blame them for that. There are growing pains with industrialization. If someone had told the US 100 years ago that we need OSHA and all those worker protections, we'd be far behind where we are today....its not pleasant that workers suffered, and its not pleasant that Chinese workers suffer today. But its not slave labor, those people chose to work, it is apparently their best option as it was for many Americans 100 years ago.
And you think their purpose is to fuck over American businesses? No, they are looking to compete and advance their economy...as we should be doing. Not just caring about some manufacturing jobs....we should be focusing on the economy at large, creating a bigger pie that we can decide how to carve up.
>>713726783
You don't know much about water filtration, do you?
>>713726902
there is a factory in san diego. true too many people... but theyre filtrating ocean water
>>713726932
How exactly do you figure a country that produces nothing is going to succeed economically.
There aren't enough jobs to go around as it is now.
>>713726985
enlighten me
>>713726783
Desalinization is too fucking expensive and very inefficient.
>>713726985
i work at a water filtration company... if you can filtrate human shit out of water and call it arrowhead you can filtrate anything
>>713726783
you obviously don't know the price and efficiency of that process compared to other means of providing clean water
>>713727083
we produce more today than we ever have, friend. Thats the great Bernie Trump misconception. see my pic related from earlier (>>713724512)
>>713726783
Wow, buddy. I'm the guy you replied to. You're not too educated on this matter. Look up desalination. Know what you're talking about before you talk about something you don't know about. Go grow a tomato plant. Water it with ocean water.
>>713727230
First, quantifying in dollar value and going back to 1940 is disingenuous.
Second, don't you think if they can do that much with so few companies that allowing room for growth will generate untold amounts of money while solving the unemployment problem?
>>713727110
>>713727213
The main reason we don't do it is because it isn't cost effective and it takes too much energy.
When did be get infested with the "me" generation?
All honestly i hope West Californians remove themselves from america.. we can keep the north side.. It'll be like keeping the best of california while removing the worst side of california.
Prove me wrong.
>>713720206
well, except for the part where hillary cheated the best candidate out of a nomination, leaving the door wide open for drumpf.
but yea, 'fair and square'
>>713727822
>implying it's trumps fault bernie got cheated by his own party
>>713726121
>muh popular vote
This is so fucking retarded.
What would happen if the candidates had campaigned to win the popular vote instead of the electoral vote? We'll never know, because the system is based on winning the electoral college, not a popularity contest.
Hillary and her supporters are doing the exact same shit they were afraid Trump and his supporters would do in this situation. Except if Hillary had won, things would have been much, much worse. And Trump would still President either way.
>>713727948
>implying that Bernie actually got cheated.
He lost. He simply did not have near enough votes.
>>713720563
> to avoid a tyranny of the majority and to have a better democratic system than europe.
nah fam, that's just what it said in the ad. they did it so they had a way to make sure the poor people couldn't elect a poor person as president. gotta keep the good shit for their own kind.
>>713727968
Pro Tip: Whatever Hillary, Obama, the mainstream media etc say people are doing, they're doing.
It's an Alinsky tactic they've milked to death lately.
>>713727636
>First, quantifying in dollar value and going back to 1940 is disingenuous.
REAL dollars, not at all disingenuous, it is controlled for inflation
>Second, don't you think if they can do that much with so few companies that allowing room for growth will generate untold amounts of money while solving the unemployment problem?
I dont know where this is coming from. We have ALOT of companies in the US. And focus on manufacturing is not going to solve employment problems. Those jobs are drying up more because of automation than outsourcing. I watched it myself in a beverage bottling factory i did business with....went from highly manual labor in the early 90s employing over 300 workers, to employing about 125 as of 2011. And their output went up! Because they had invested in machines to replace people. And if they didnt, they would've gone out of business because their competitors were doing the same thing.
I dont have all the answers for where laborers will find work in the 21st century. I would suggest finding a skill that cannot easily be automated. But I am confident that American ingenuity will find employment for the masses...but not if we keep try to stop progress and keep what we had...if we do that we will never reclaim what we had and we will lose out on the jobs of the future too.
Remove California but keep Texas in your scenario? This is a stupid game.
>>713728045
>he lost
except everyone knows that the DNC and MSM colluded with the Clinton campaign to black ball Bernie and fuck him out of it in every way they could.
>>713728271
But even if they didn't it wouldn't have mattered. He fell way short of the needed votes and delegates.
>>713728220
Ok take that bottling plant for an example.
You now have enough employees for three bottling plants. Resources aren't really a problem, this is America. That's three times the money instead of pumping more money into welfare.
>>713728628
go ahead and build 3 more bottling plants....will anyone buy 3x as much iced tea? You need the demand there to meet your supply. Just building plants to employ people rather than to meet a demand is not very wise...thats commie shit.
>>713716378
>How's this:
>According to current calculations:
>Hillary won the popular vote 47.8% to Trumps 47.3%
>
>Trump won the electoral college and the election.
>
>Hillary won California by 61.6% of the vote to Trump's 33.1%
>
>If we remove California, then Trump won the rest of the country by 51.3% to Hillary's 48.7%.
>
>So if you go by popular vote, you could say Hillary is the President of California and Trump is the President of the rest of the country.
>
>The real question is do we want California or any other large state to decide the fate of the nation.
>
>What would an election look like if we only used the popular vote? California and a few other states would decide it. The rest of the country? Oh Well!
>
>So, all you liberals out there that have minority interests so dear to your hearts, what do you have to say?
>
>And as to all this litigation: All you liberals who think that money should not influence the elective process, what do you say about someone with a wealthy foundation behind them trying to throw the election?
This is not based out of compassion nor evidence.
This is why conservatives are hard to take seriously. It's because you're opinions are based around hate, instead of the improvement of social well being.
So imagine our lack of patience when it comes to literal racists making legislation. It just doesn't make any god dammed sense
>>713728461
Superdelegates aside he was actually fairly close.
>>713728790
Three times as many employed people with three times as many varieties of iced tea on the market. That's not commie shit.
Welfare is commie shit.
>>713728461
But that doesn't change anything. DNC and MSM still colluded together to do everything they could to get Hillary in the White House, right down to asking her campaign for questions they should ask Trump and Bernie and sending them questions they would ask Hillary so she could read them over.
>>713729318
That's politics. I'm sure Trump did the same with Fox news. The big difference is that no one has leaked that out yet.
>>713717625
Howso? Please expand upon your statement.
Meanwhile, I'll enjoy my nice, long shower while my sprinklers water my lawn. Maybe a dip in my pool later is also in order.
>>713729228
Bottling plant capacity is already too high. Demand is going down for all bottled beverages except water. And let me tell you about the new bottled water factory I visited last year. It was a fucking ghost town. Automated, laser guided forklifts and shit. There were maybe 20 employees in a factory that produced as many cases as the ice tea factory I mentioned earlier.
I agree, lets put people to work. Welfare isn't great, but I do think its necessary in a rich society like ours, if for no other reason than that kids born into poverty dont get completely btfo and never have any sort of chance to make anything of themselves.
But my main point is that manufacturing jobs are drying up and there is very little that can be done to stop it. We should be focusing on education and tech.
>>713729516
You mean the same Fox news that shit on him right up until he won?
There are 3,141 counties in the United States.
Trump won 3,084 of them.
Clinton won 57.
There are 62 counties in New York State.
Trump won 46 of them.
Clinton won 16.
Clinton won the popular vote by approx. 1.5 million votes.
In the 5 counties that encompass NYC, (Bronx, Brooklyn, Manhattan, Richmond & Queens) Clinton received well over 2 million more votes than Trump. (Clinton only won 4 of these counties; Trump won Richmond)
Therefore these 5 counties alone, more than accounted for Clinton winning the popular vote of the entire country.
These 5 counties comprise 319 square miles.
The United States is comprised of 3, 797,000 square miles.
When you have a country that encompasses almost 4 million square miles of territory, it would be ludicrous to even suggest that the vote of those who inhabit a mere 319 square miles should dictate the outcome of a national election.
Large, densely populated Democrat cities (NYC, Chicago, LA, etc) don’t and shouldn’t speak for the rest of our country.
>>713729652
Fox news is the reason that Hillary's message didn't reach more moderates.
>>713716378
I you remove 3-4 million illegal votes
Trump won both the collage and popular
>>713730164
Illegals aren't allowed to vote dumb ass.
>>713730261
this.
but they should be.
>>713730261
They aren't allowed to, but they still do.
>>713730418
There's no proof of this. Only Trump saying that it happened, but that doesn't make it true.
>>713716378
>The real question is do we want California or any other large state to decide the fate of the nation.
Are you saying that the population of a large state is insignificant? That their vote is worthless? That due to where they live, their vote is meaningless?
>What would an election look like if we only used the popular vote? California and a few other states would decide it. The rest of the country? Oh Well!
Not necessarily. If the majority of people WHO VOTED, voted for a particular candidate, then that candidate would win. Simple.
>So, all you liberals out there that have minority interests so dear to your hearts, what do you have to say?
Liberal here who voted for Trump. While I'm not in favor of Hillary, I am in favor of the popular vote deciding the election. I also believe that we should have much higher voter turnout so that it won't be a few deciding for the many, but that's on those who didn't vote.
>And as to all this litigation: All you liberals who think that money should not influence the elective process, what do you say about someone with a wealthy foundation behind them trying to throw the election?
Money should be able to influence elections. More specifically, individual contributions should be able to influence elections, not SuperPACs or other large foundations. Large contributions ($10k+ or so) shouldn't be allowed and it should be anonymized.
>>713716378
>Hillary won the popular vote 47.8% to Trumps 47.3%
48.2% to 46.3%, you mean.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/133Eb4qQmOxNvtesw2hdVns073R68EZx4SfCnP4IGQf8/htmlview?sle=true#gid=19
>>713730536
If you actually think that illegals don't vote in states that make it incredibly easy to do then you're completely retarded.
>>713730668
exactly. trumpians are always trying to candycoat his loss of the popular vote, which is growing, and is now over 4 million votes.
>>713726783
Arnold used that as a running platform for his election in cali once in office he realized that the technology wasn't there yet and it was way too expensive and he dropped it
>>713730164
>Trump collage
We need better education in this country
>>713719805
Get a load of this retard
>>713730538
>popular vote deciding the election.
Welcome to Idiocracy.
>>713731077
Trump didn't pursue the mythical "popular vote," because the race is to 270 electoral votes.
>>713731181
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWToW9ZNOpo
>>713731077
Nah. It's currently a little over 2 1/2 million. That's still quite considerable at 1.9% of the vote though.
Anybody remember what Trump said when Romney was briefly ahead in the popular vote in 2012?
1860: Democrats lose election, throw hissy fit.
2016: Democrats lose election, throw hissy fit.
>>713717930
>implying economy wants stricter gunlaws
Drink less moonshine Cleatus. You dont make sense.
If it was for the economy there were no regulation at all.
>>713731980
And yet, after that he ran with the same EC rules and won.
So what?
>>713731751
This.
That is how the election works. Both Trump and Clinton knew that going into it.
Democrats have won the popular vote 4 out of the 5 last presidential elections, but only claimed the presidency 2 times. And the 1 time they lost the popular vote, the Republicans had the advantage of incumbency, which they would not have had if they hadn't taken the White House despite losing the popular vote the time before.
If this had happened to Republicans, they would be literally burning the country down. Note what Trump said in >>713731980 when Romney was briefly ahead, even though it was obvious to any thinking person that the west coast votes would swing the popular vote strongly in Obama's favor. Note also all the talk about the system being rigged this time around.
>>713732275
>And yet, after that he ran with the same EC rules and won.
Saying that the system was rigged and that he wouldn't accept the results unless he won.
>>713730164
You don't get to just make shit up.
It's not set in stone that Trump has won yet. The EC has a completely legitimate and legal option to select Hillary as the winner. Especially since she has such a large win via the popular vote.
>>713732704
So basically: "The system is rigged and illegitimate, and I won't accept its results! Wait... I won? Why won't you accept the legitimate results of this legitimate election?"
>>713718883
He didn't flip flop anything, even after he won he was still complaining about the elrctoral college.
>>713733052
it was set in stone the day after the election you libtard,go back to your safe space and cry about reality some more
>>713733576
>it was set in stone the day after the election
>reality
pick only one
>>713725171
This. A lot of people feel this way, or are at least wanting some reassurance that the USA has not turned into a banana republic.
>>713732433
That would be fine if it were a game where Clinton and Trump were competing to win. But I don't give a damn about making Clinton or Trump happy. An election should be about the will of the people.
Also, but for a combination of Russian and FBI intervention, Trump would not have won the electoral college. If the popular vote had swung only 8/10 of a percent in Clintons favor in the swing states, she would've won Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and Michigan, and taken the election. If it had swung 1.2% in her favor, she would also have taken Florida.
And sure, all the email leaks and FBI stuff wouldn't have happened if there was nothing there, but it's not like Trump and the RNC didn't have stuff to hide. And if the Russians had hacked that shit and Comey had made comments about the Trump University scandal in the last days of the election, shit would've been very different. Especially if they had done that *instead of* focusing on Hillary. So don't lie to yourself. Putin installed Trump and the FBI helped him. If either one had not been pulling from Trump, Clinton would've won.
>>713725171
>>713734191
Good, then we agree. I think we need federal voter ID laws A.S.A.P.
>>713734252
The race was already starting to tighten, but after Comey made his announcement, the rate of that tightening dramatically accelerated. The polls shifted about 4 points in Trump's favor after the announcement, and if just 1/4 of that movement was due to Comey, that means he threw the election.
>>713734565
>voter ID laws
WRONG! That would simply disenfranchise minorities and college students. Both of which are heavily democrat voters, which is exactly why republicans so staunchly support voter ID legislation. There's nothing wrong with the way things are currently done. We simply need to monitor the electronic results better and ensure that Russians or anyone else isn't tampering.
>>713734565
>I think we need federal voter ID laws A.S.A.P.
I'm fine with that as long as we get rid of the need to register ahead of time.
>>713717181
Shut the fuck up commiefornian
>>713734818
How does it disenfranchise minorities and college students? In order to get one you'd prove your citizenship and identity to some state office that'll then issue you an ID. Unless you're intentionally insulting minorities and college students intelligence, then you are sadly misinformed. Both groups seem to have no trouble getting drivers licenses, it'd be very similar to that process.
>>713734818
>That would simply disenfranchise minorities and college students
How? Both groups already have IDs. You need and ID to drive, to buy cigarettes, to buy liquor, to attend college, etc...
That disenfranchise bullshit is just a meme that libs who know that they cheat use to keep their ability to cheat wide open. IDs would make it very hard for cartoon characters, pets, dead people, and illegal aliens to vote. All of which happen to be "primarily democrat voters" as you put it.
The IDs would be free, and every legal citizen could get one.
>>713734881
That would be good too. Parties might still require registration to have an affiliation with them though. That would probably be up to them.
How's this. Less than 1/3 of America even voted. You're both losers, but you need your hand held.
TRUMP
TRUMP
TRUMP
TRUMP
TRUMP
He's already winning and he's not even president yet
Suck on it liberal fags
>>713734818
>Both of which are heavily democrat voters, which is exactly why republicans so staunchly support voter ID legislation.
Of course that's the reason they're doing it, which is why I have an issue with it. But getting rid of the need to register to vote ahead of time should help counterbalance that. And sure, it's trying to fix a nonexistent problem, but whatever.
Oh, and while we're at it, let's let Washington DC vote in congress. The population of Washington is greater than that of Wyoming, and Wyoming gets 2 votes in the Senate and 1 in the House, while Washington gets nothing.
>>713735396
>He's already winning
How so exactly?
>>713719778
that's primary, not general
>>713734818
Disenfranchise minorities and college students? Sorry, but it would not do that. The only people it would disenfranchise would be people that are not supposed to vote, like convicted felons and non-citizens.
>>713735581
felons can vote in many states, except southern states mostly. that is a racist law, which was intended to stifle black voters, because many of them were felons. we need to strike that law from the books too. as long as you are not currently in prison, jail, on probation, or parole, and have completely served your sentence, then you should be able to vote. it's time to dump these racist jim crow style laws from our law books.
>>713735517
Some of the headlines lately:
TRUMP PREVENTS CARRIER, FORD FROM MOVING JOBS TO MEXICO
TRUMP EFFECT: STOCKS RALLY TO RECORD HIGHS
DOLLAR BEST RISE IN EIGHT YEARS FOLLOWING ELECTION
Read some news buddy. Everybody with money and a brain are getting ready for Trump's economic boom implemented by lower taxes and infrastructure spending (BUILD THAT WALL!)
>>713720777
checked
>>713735322
>That disenfranchise bullshit is just a meme
Not at all. It would affect a relatively small percentage of people, but those people are more likely to vote Democratic (old black people, in particular, are less likely to have IDs), which is the entire reason that Republicans are pushing it. They didn't suddenly become really worried about the statistically nonexistent problem of people voting illegally. But making our system more secure is a good aim in and of itself, which is why I'm okay with it if we counterbalance the advantage to Republicans by taking away the need to pre-register to vote. I mean, if you're bring in your ID, that should be sufficient.
It's sort of like how it's okay if the school board votes that you can't wear hoop earrings to the prom (or that men can't wear earrings at all), but it's not okay if it's making that rule because you know it will disproportionately affect black people and you're hoping they won't show up.
>>713735892
Trump hasn't done shit yet, you're kidding yourself if you actually believe that.
The stocks and value of the dollar are because of Obama digging us out of Bush's recession. It took a long time, but it was quite a train wreck that Bush got us into.
As far as companies deciding to keep plants or not, that is on them and not Trump.
Holy fuck you people are delusional.
>>713735820
You're thinking ex-convicts, people that served their time. What was being described as "convicted felons" was "currently serving a sentence for a felony offense". They forfeit their right to vote when they were charged and convicted beyond reasonable doubt.
>>713736217
>>Holy fuck you people are delusional
First time dealing with americans? They're all this retarded.
>>713716378
This bait is just too retarded for words or memes.
>>713723840
Dude you have drank far to many marijuanas.
>>713736144
>old black people, in particular, are less likely to have IDs
Bullshit. They need ID to do all of those things I pointed out earlier, including cashing their disability checks or whatever other checks they get. Pretty much everyone has ID in the US now. The government would give the first one for free, and groups would help those unable to get to the centers do so for free. Not a big deal at all. The whole "racist" or "disenfranchisement" thing *is* a meme, and a lie.
>>713735892
Remember when stocks were surging under Obama? Besides, there are tons of stories about Trump's conflicts of interest, lies, and so forth.
>Trump's economic boom implemented by lower taxes and infrastructure spending
Obama has been trying to pass infrastructure spending for a long time now and Republicans have been blocking it. Also, lowering taxes and spending a bunch of money on infrastructure can certainly boost the economy, but only at the cost of ballooning the deficit. It's short term gain for long term sacrifice. And under certain circumstances, I'm okay with something like that (like to claw your way out of a recession, for instance), but I don't think giving a bunch of money to rich people right now is going to be a net gain.
>>713736219
still many states don't let them vote even as ex-cons who were previously convicted of any felonies. this was done exactly for the reasons that i stated, and needs to change.
>>713736217
>>713729706
Actually, assuming your argument is leaning toward your solution, having the winner based on some generic square milage feelsbad arithmetic is even dumber. The vote should represent the voting population, not what they own or where they own it. If you all want to live in 500 sq miles, so be it, its not like your vote carries less weight.
>>713736747
https://exoffenders.net/felon-voting-rights/
Which one? Grant it that I briefly scrolled through it but for the most part, all of them seem to restore the rights after their time has been served, even the southern states.
>>713736545
>Pretty much everyone has ID in the US now.
Which is why I said it would only affect a small percentage. What part of small percentage do you not understand?
>The government would give the first one for free, and groups would help those unable to get to the centers do so for free. Not a big deal at all.
There was some concern about there not being places to get IDs in some areas. As long as that's fairly addressed, I'm okay with it though--as long as we ditch pre-registration while we're at it.
>The whole "racist" or "disenfranchisement" thing *is* a meme, and a lie.
No it's not. You're delusional if you don't think that the reason Republicans are pushing this is because it will help them electorally.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/inside-the-republican-creation-of-the-north-carolina-voting-bill-dubbed-the-monster-law/2016/09/01/79162398-6adf-11e6-8225-fbb8a6fc65bc_story.html?utm_term=.0705ddcf4405
>>713736929
off the top of my head, florida comes to mind.
>>713736929
>>713736747
Nevermind, found Florida, Mississippi, and Kentucky.
>>713736929
In Florida, Iowa and Virginia, felons and ex-felons permanently lose their right to vote. Two of those are majorly-important swing states.
>>713736929
Whater you talking about, most states still enforce disenfranchisement of voting rights for a felony conviction.
>>713737233
Then here comes the next argument: Voter ID Laws being decided at the state level for state elections instead of federal/national elections.
>>713737233
>>713737162
Alabama, Arizona, Florida, Iowa, Kentucky, Mississippi, Nevada, Virginia, Wyoming.
>>713737003
>You're delusional if you don't think that the reason Republicans are pushing this
Actually I think this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDc8PVCvfKs
is the reason that they're pushing it. I support voter ID, and I am an independent voter. I believe that everyone who's a legal citizen should be allowed to vote ONCE per election.
HERES AN IDEA!! STOP BREAKING THE LAW!! ASSHOLE!!!! THEN U VOTE
>>713737600
but that's a lie. there is no actual evidence of vote fraud committed by voters other than o'keefe's heavily edited bullshit video.
to date, the only evidence of tampering is that of the russian government.
>>713737602
TBH when those laws were made the only felonies were bank robbery, murder, and kidnapping. Same time that they said that felons couldn't own firearms. Now practically everything is a felony. In some states DUI can even be a felony, and getting into a car accident by yourself can be as well. The laws in this country are fucked up.
The prison industry (that's right it's an industry) keeps lobbying the politicians to make more and more things crimes, and to stiffen the penalties on other things. This is a constant process.
>>713736346
If you read carefully, you would find that he is an American.
