>>702881483 i am looking, and looking is what's causing me to believe it isn't a giant ball at all
>>702881392 it could though, the sun could be WAY closer than they say it is, and it can just light up half of the earth while the other half is lit by the moon. this is honestly not that outlandish, if you compare it to the sun being billions of miles away but hitting earth at just the right spot and right temperature.
>>702882347 >because my 5 senses yup, totally infallible factors. there has been no instances in recorded history where our senses haven't been facetious 100%.
that claim doesn't even make sense when you understand that you aren't standing on a small ball, you're standing on a sphere that dwarfs you a trillion:1, so of course your puny self can't see the curvature. it's like expecting an ant to be able to see the curvature of the new years ball while it's standing on it.
>even mathematics and experiments point to flat earth..and that gravity isn't even a thing. great evidence. super specific. ty for sources. cuz really...if flat earth existed, current gps configurations wouldn't work
>>702882653 that doesn't have to be gravity that can just be my density just falling through the air hitting a sturdy surface
>>702882680 noo, you would have to eliminate everything you know about the universe. earth is the center here and the sun is our ray of light. not the solar systems, but it's for US. the size, temperature and distance are alll made up by nasa religion
>>702882959 my 5 senses are in fact infallible, because how else would anyone know the earth was round hundreds of years ago? they would have to guess. yes, but the mathematics of the proportions we can get the curvature and it just isn't there. the only reason the ant would be on a ball is because we see it. but who sees us on the ball of earth?
>>702883806 seasons can be explained. horizon is always flat
star positions are all relative to where we stand on a flat OR round earth..the shape of other planets are circles sure..but who's to say that they are actually "planets" and the actual size that they tell us
>>702884145 of course they can, the sun moves away from the souther hemishphere during summer in the north, then it moves back slowly for winter in the north and summer in the south. look at the sun video i linked. the mathematical equations are the SAME for flat or ball. that's so fishy to me.
also, horizons are just your plane of vision .. it has nothing to do with a flat earth or ball earth.
Ever seen a time lapse pointed at polaris? The whole night sky rotates around this point. Do the same thing in the southern hemisphere and you get the whole thing spinning around a different point (sigma octanis).
So feel free to try and explain how you a celestial dome has two points of rotation, the first of which is visible within the center, and the second of which becomes visible towards the outside edge.
You guys, you're taking the bait a little too hard.
Here is how you solve the problem, if the unironic are at least reasonable folk who believe in empirical evidence.
To prove the following, you cannot stand on your living room table.
You need to take a plane over a very flat area. Like the middle of the south of the US. Or towards the west coast, like Nevada. Or, up north, Alberta.
Generally speaking, you will see the curvature of the planet anyways, when you are that high up, as you turn your attention to the horizon.
Now, if you still don't believe all of this, I want all of you who disagree with the round earth to get a clear glass, and fill it with water. I then want you to find something that emits light, like a flashlight. Get a blank piece of paper, place the glass with water over it. Once you've done all of this, get something like a pencil or a straw. Put it inside the glass.
Look at it from the top down. What do you see?
Look at it from the side. What do you see?
Shine a light through the top on an angle, and look from the side. What do you see?
That, my friends, is optics. Specifically, the angle of incedence, at play. Light bends in mediums.
Light bends in gravity.
Guess what? Light bends across the horizon sometimes. That's why the sky is still red when you can't see the sun after it has set. That's more than enough proof that, because you can still see the light from the sun illuminating the sky, but not see the sun directly, that the land before you must curve, otherwise, the light wouldn't be able to travel to you, because it would all be >behind, under, or obstructed by flat land.
None of you who take this seriously need take this as fact just yet. Just let it sit for a bit. It's food for thought.
>>702885032 maybe it is the same star at different angles? i don't know i'd have to look that up. that seems like the only thing that can debunk this flat earth. but howcome there is no apparent or even measurable curvature? howcome the state of kansas has the same level for 400 miles? howcome that doesn't curve. either the earth is wayyyy bigger than tehy tell us or it's flat..deception is still there
>>702885293 I live in Ontario, and let me tell you flat earthers, I can actually see the curve from a few freeways/highways. I mention Ontario, because it is quite literally just soil on tons and tons of rock.
Like a lot of rock. A really big rock. I've seen at least 3 kinds of horizons just by driving for 45 minutes.
>>702885801 You may be looking for a curve in the wrong way, focusing on a point in the foreground, rather than the entire picture.
In order to perceive the change, you probably also want to be watching while you take off, maybe 5 or 7 minutes afterwards. Then watch when the seatbelt sign is off. Do a full 360, as much as possible.
You'll see the change, and while I can't guarantee that, I can't lie about seeing curves.
>>702885680 Air is like water. Air is not exactly like water, but Air is not nothingness.
Light in air is not the same as light in space. Light in water is not the same as light in air. By demonstrating to yourself that this is true, by shining light in water and watching it bend instead of shine right thought both the glass and the water (like it is wont to in air)...
It should seem valid that light can, and then probably does, bend when it makes the transition from the vacuum of space, to our atmosphere. Ever wonder why the sky is blue?
>>702885256 >maybe it is the same star at different angles? Nope. Here's a star map. (Which works by the way, people have been navigating with this shit for hundreds of years) It lines up seamlessly and continuously along the edges of the circles.
Point a compass north and you'll find polaris straight up if you're deep enough in the northern hemisphere. Point it south and you'll line up with the sigma octanis one in the same way assuming you're in the southern hemisphere.
>why no curve? The earth is over 40 thousand kilometers in circumference. Divide that by degrees. Your kansas gap is less than a 4 degree slice of that pie. Less than 4 degrees worth of curve, over natural terrain. No shit there's no apparent measurable curvature.
>>702886223 ok so you're not lying about seeing curves, but don't you think i've looked in every possible way to see curve? i'm not dumb even though im saying the earth might be flat..you've seen it but i haven't. i have done what you described anyways
and yeah air is not nothingness but i've never seen light bend in the air. and idk why does the sky appear blue instead of another color? howcome light only appears to bend when it's at the horizon, and not on top of us
Gravity has honestly never completely made sense to me....why can't we as humans create a smaller version of the solar system that would actually simulate a small ball creating gravity...if fractals are real, a small ball spinning on a string would create a very tiny gravitational pull, but rather anything on the ball goes flying off
>>702880770 The earth being round is physically impossible, and has no imperical evidence. There is actually plenty of evidence to the contrary. For example, observing the suns rays through the clouds. Perspective will tell you the sun isn't too far above the clouds
>>702887019 There's no evidence to the contrary. Hell there's video proof of it being round, not to mention mathematical proof and the fact that all natural phenonmena on earth only makes sense with a round planet
>>702882680 If it were right above the clouds, and illuminated the land you inhabit for half the day, it would get hot when the sun was out for a couple of hours, kind of like it does now. And get colder the longer night is present, like it does in reality
Reasons why the Earth is truly spherical 1. Gravity - Gravity pulls atoms towards the center of mass, thus a spherical shape of a planet ( http://physics.weber.edu/amiri/physics1010online/WSUonline12w/OnLineCourseMovies/CircularMotion&Gravity/reviewofgravity/ReviewofGravity.html ) Move evidence available if requested 2. The horizon - Now this may be the most talked about/argued about thing that flat earthers deny or try to debunk with pseudo-science, but the horizon, albiet less noticeable, at sea level is still there. Raise your altitude a bit to... say 50,000 meters. You start to see the curvature of the Earth around you as the atmosphere seems to become more and more transparent. The farthest you can see is around 10-15% of the Earth's surface. Raise a bit higher to 100,000 meters. You are technically in space now, and able to see at least 25% of the Earth's surface. Look around, you will notice the circular shape to the eye. If you aren't seeing it in 3D(one eye missing/damaged/closed), then it appears to be flat. If the Earth WERE flat, then at 100,000 meters, you would be able to see the WHOLE Earth, not just ~25%. 3. Geological/Magnetic evidence - Auroras are generated as solar wind is bent and curved by our magnetic field, generated deep within the Earth's core by molten iron, nickel, and other magnetic metals moving and churning in such a way that generates magnetism on a large scale. The Auroras are a result that could only be produced the way they are on a spherical Earth. Go to Southern Greenland while Aurora Borealis is visible to the naked eye. Looks pretty straight, right? Go to Russia, same angle. Go to the North magnetic pole, and now you see a flowery, almost circular shape in the sky. Why? The curvature of the magnetic field produces the Aurora on a spherical shape, not a flat one. If you were standing on a flat Earth, you would not be able to see Aurora Australis the same way. Checkem
Constellations, Polaris, iss, the sun, the oceans, currents, weather, the moon, space travel, seasons, the earths 23.5 degree tilt, the way mars moves through the sky, observations of jupiters moons transiting its surface, venus and Mercury transit across the sun, observations and provable predictions of nearly every astronomical event. >theres just not enough evidence that the earth is round.
>>702886733 I mean, I know it may not be reasonable to have you put all of your faith in one sole image, but if you will humor me...
I've seen and looked through a lot of glass. And I can tell you right now, that glass is not the reason you may see a curve in the horizon.
Light does bend in the air... it's just not as observable. In fact, it's a bit of a point-of-reference kind of thing. It's more than just the air, and in fact, it has more to do with the light. Especially with why the sky is blue.
Rayleigh scattering. >the scattering of light by particles in a medium >without change in wavelength >It accounts, for example, for the blue color of the sky >since blue light is scattered slightly more efficiently than red >particle theory of light and wave theory of light
In a nutshell, when light attempts to pass through mediums, it has to find alternative paths to its destination, because the medium is in its way. The result is that the quantum from the light (the potential energy variance/stepping up and down of energy) becomes more visible, because the particles of light sometimes, in fact, bounce off particles of the medium. Sometimes, a lot of particles go in one such direction, such that you see said lower level of energy as "blue".
Whereas, if you view light as waves, it's simply that the waves bounce off of the matter, and the magnitude of waves in one given region of space is lesser than the combined magnitudes of all waves that were present; you get the blue frequency of light.
Light does bend, you just won't always be able to see it actually bend, like a ray of light, in air. But, it does bend. Even when it's coming directly down on top of us. It's just a matter of perspective- you'd never be able to see light bend in the X axis if you're viewing it from the bottom up, on the Y axis. It would just look like more light was coming at you.
>>702887034 Sorry, I was head-mathing it. Switched to imperial. It's a little less than 6 degrees. Keep in mind, sea level curves with the earth, so you aren't going to be able to measure the curve against that.
>>702881301 >but like how? i wanna see where it's obviously a ball
And so, because you haven't been to like 50,00 feet in the air to see the curvature, and you won't believe photos and videos from "NASA" (does that include the Chinese, Japanese, Russian, European, and Indian space programs too?), you decide that flat is a better choice?
>>702887708 i understand what you're speaking of i guess, but this could still explain why horizons and sun bends on a flat earth as well. and for ur picture, well, ive been higher than that and seen no curve.
>>702886982 >why can't we as humans create a smaller version of the solar system that would actually simulate a small ball creating gravity...if fractals are real, a small ball spinning on a string would create a very tiny gravitational pull
Well, given that the force of gravity is directly related to mass, a small model wouldn't be able to produce gravity.
That said, there is an experiment to measure the force of gravity. It involves hanging something similar to a dumbbell from a very thin, long wire, and mounting two very massive balls in the swing radius of the dumbbell. The gravity of the balls all attract, and the torque produced in the wire is a means to measure the force.
Well, it's that horizons and the sun could not permit the same phenomenon on a flat Earth.
You would have to explain how the light manages to beat the immediate face/edge of the flat Earth when the sun sets, so that the sky turns a pale pink/orange/yellow/red. Light... cannot climb over obstacles, exactly. That is why shadows exist.
If the same thing were to somehow happen to a flat Earth, you would end up with immediate darkness following the very moment the sun dipped over the horizon. A giant shadow would have to be cast over the entire edge of the flat Earth, in the best case scenario.
If you don't believe me, place an opaque, solid, straight-edged object in front of a mobile, bright light source (like a flashlight).
Here's the deal: there are two types of Flat Earthers: trolls, and literal Bible interpreters. Somewhat surprisingly, we usually encounter the latter on /b/. They have the freedom to make shit up (lie) because truth and understanding are not their goals, and they end the arguments with "prove me wrong." By disavowing any science put forward and continuing to make shit up, they "win" by attrition. It is simply impossible to keep up with having to explain away the barrage of the violations of the most basic principles of geometry, math, science, and logic. They aren't interested in critical thinking or putting in the requisite effort to do the science. Proofs are tossed aside, or they may not even respond when they can't fabricate anything that would pass even their own red-faced test. They are blind to 3D visualualization. They concentrate on believing what their leaders tell them, and will not allow any sense to mar their fractured perception of the universe. There is simply no arguing. It's like trying to paint over mud. You just end up with a dirty brush.
If the Earth was flat and the Sun hovered above it and moved in a great circle around the pole, you would see a difference in motion most marked at times of rise and set. Place yourself on the equator during the equinox. At rise, the Sun would appear somehow and from north of the equator, with movment to the right/south (following its circular path), its horizontal motion diminshing over the course of the morning. As it reached overhead (Noon) it would be moving most quickly and straight east-west. After Noon it would appear to slow down and begin its drift right (north), and farther along it loses the vertical movement (never setting) while gaining the drift to the right and magically disappearing.
That of course, is not what we see. The Sun rises due east, transits straight up, and sets due west all at a constant angular speed all along its path, which is apparently straight up, over, and down, because in this geometry you (not a distant pole) are at the center of a circle it appears to trace.
Also, a close-proximity Sun would increase in brightness from invisible at "rise" to its brightest at Noon and back again to invisible at "set" in the course of one day. The graph of the intensity of the received light would vary by the square of the distance of the Sun. This means the increase/decrease in brightness would vary most radically around Noon. Again, we don't see that. We see the Sun remain more or less constant in brightness during the day, with a good accounting (and weather-dependent) for its dimming when near the horizon due to atmospheric opacity.
>>702888665 That's based solely on your opinion, not fact.
There’s a common conception that an opinion cannot be wrong. An opinion is a preference for or judgment of something, such as a preference for a color. In this context it is true that an opinion cannot be "wrong." Eventually you might venture out and find that what you thought was an informed opinion was actually based on inadequate data, and your feelings. For instance you may have never seen any fluorescent colors, and become enamored with a blue when you do. You can be wrong or ignorant - everyone is, about many things. Reality does not care about your feelings. Education does not exist to persecute you, but to help you make informed decisions. You may believe autism and vaccines are linked. I may believe in angels. Neither belief is rooted in any sort of fact and our uninformed opinions are in general not worthy of respect or notice. As soon as you post on the Internet, you are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to what you can argue for.
>>702879565 everything matters dude. Tangentally speaking, maybe your skin color matters because black people are disproportionately unable to access education. Pick up a physics book for once, or look into a telescope, hell, even try traveling below the equator. Notice that while its summer here, it's winter there because the earth is tilted on its axis. Or try reading this message; my ISP is a satellite internet service.
The angle of incidence? Why your line of sight will change as you change your elevation? The horizon, and why the sun setting yet illuminating the sky is counter-intuitive to the concept of a flat earth?
>>702888744 so how can 16% of the earth's circumference (if the earth was a round, the earth's circumference is officially 24,901 miles) not account for any curves? math is fact. the math doesn't add up. i don't want theories i want straight facts. fuckin in my face evidence
A rotating image with two points of rotation in alternating directions, the second of which can be seen in a consistent direction from separate points of observation all around the outer edge IS impossible.
>>702888838 >>702889074 No, this is what Donald Trump sounds like: >You see, when you look at the planet... >when you look at the horizon >you tend to notice that, "Hey, what's up with all the bendy stuff?" >Am I right? Am I right guys? And then you go stand on a building...
Don't make this political, though. It didn't, and doesn't need to become about politics. Unless you're just shitting up the thread... which, hey, it was kind of going places.
>>702888742 This video is patently wrong. the sky still rotates east to west in the southern hemisphere, but when you look up to the southern pole, the sky appears to rotate clockwise, not widdershins as we see it here in the north. It's just wrong. It's a lie.
>>702889133 i cannot stop laughing. open to the truth? i guess you are not open to the truth because you can't handle the truth. truth is, you are nuts. maybe it is you who is scared to admit you are wrong faggot
>>702889128 No, it doesn't. It lies. You watched it in ignorance and bought it. I'm an astronomer. This is second nature to me. The video is full of shit. And I'm not going to sit through 18 minutes of that crap. You tell me what minute.second mark to go to to explain why folks in South Africa, Australia, and Terra del Fuego see the same stars.
No, you know what, your eyes, which are more than half water, have nothing to do with the way you see things.
You just, go right along and dry them out completely.
It's not like there are oceans, or rainclouds, or water molecules in the air present often. Or, you know... basic science. Like the machine you're using right now to interact with us. And some other stuff.
There was a serious discussion about autism on another thread. It dawned on me that Flat-Earthers (FEs) fit the description of being autistic exactly. Here are some salient extracts: >The thing about autism is they cannot read other people, they live in their own world. So, oblivious that no one gives two shits what they have to say, they continue their monologue until you literally run away. >Autism seldom comes on its own; usually there are other mental problems, and these can be an indicator. For instance, they may have been in "special" classes, or disgnosed with ADD, or loved ones desperately smile and shrug off awkward conversations/situations and the autists does not recognize situational discomfort. This behavior is particularly consistent among FE arguments: >I really really find it difficult to change my opinions, even when the other person is factually correct. For instance, I once argued with a teacher till 6 PM over the correct, or at least effectively correct, use of parentheses. I'm still convinced I was right. >Not all autistic people actually understand autism. They may have gotten a simplified and inaccurate description of what it is. Also, they may be so high functioning that they feel like it'd just be better if everyone was like them. Straight forward, overt, blunt. Very high functioning people often don't like to think of their difficulties as defects, but due to failures of normal people to be more transparent.
Can we just send one of these rich famous dumb niggers to space so they can look at it and send a snapchat and Twitter a pic to all the other dumb ape niggers (seeing as that's all they understand is social media) and stop making their culture that much more intolerable?
For satellite dish to satellite dish on the surface of earth connections over large distances for establishing data networks you have to add the curvature of the earth into the calculation or it won't work but it does when you do.
Snipers also do this for far shots including bullet grain / load and bullet drop.
Mortars over long distances.
Tanks and missles.
There is a live feed from iss.
Eclipses show the earth being round.
Go to the ocean or desert or anywhere flat and you can see it. Fly in a plane and you can see it.
Lastly. Who benefits from the earth being actually flat? Why would anyone lie about it? What is the gain?
>>702890222 because that's how spheres work. if it was a sphere, the ship should disappear mast first because that's how the shape of a sphere would allow it to disappear from the horizon..if it just looks like it sinks, that doesnt seem like its going OVER the horizon, just sinking
>>702890536 >because that's how spheres work. if it was a sphere, the ship should disappear mast first because that's how the shape of a sphere would allow it to disappear from the horizon..if it just looks like it sinks, that doesnt seem like its going OVER the horizon, just sinking
And with that, I clean my brush and say good night.
>>702888461 >It is simply impossible to keep up with having to explain away the barrage of the violations of the most basic principles of geometry, math, science, and logic. >They are blind to 3D visualualization.
>>702890646 Explain them. If the earth is flat there is no curvature or is the flat earth a half globe. An inverted bowl of space cereal.
How to control the world if nobody knows the shape of the earth?
False flags that let you war for resources makes more sense. Dumbing and placating citizens with chemicals makes more sense. Killing people who challenge the status quo makes more sense. Child sacrifices to giant owls to get more mana makes more sense.
>>702891470 A horizon is perceivable but actual analysis of curvature using your eyes isn't possible. As far as kansas is concerned. It's inevitable that a planet surrounded in mountains has one region that is fairly flat
Ur all stupid, of course the earth is flat. Where is the hot spot on a round earth? Why do you see a line to the sun as it sets instead of a hot spot. Shine a light in a ball and get it to make a line like this..
>>702889867 Haha you are now reaching for schematics. Explain how the water in your eyes and your little experiment with a piece of paper, straw, glass of water and flashlight have anything to do with how we percieve the suns light, and it tricks us into believing the earth is flat
>>702888742 >forced perspective because you see the horizon as FLAT Except... it IS flat in your model. So there's no optical trick. >North is south and south is north HA! >Polaris would have to be matching earth's wobble >Stars would shift relative to each other based on the earth's new position OR we're just dealing with distances so vast that the earth's relative movement is basically like being stationary.
>>702889176 Jesus Christ fuck donald trump. Guy is a failure time and time again. Its a serious wonder how he is not broke with how many business failures he has had. Probably because he started.off with a silver spoon and his dads entire business network to start.
>>702892482 No one even knew what you were talking about in your experiment :p I assume because I didn't, and I condisder myself to be above average in intellect, and no one commented agreeing or anything either
I don't care if it doesn't fit your model. This is how the real world works. Go to the southern hemisphere and you will see this shit with your own damn eyes. If you can't fit this into your model then your model doesn't reflect reality.
well op here, haven't been convinced that the earth is flat...yet the stars being different in the south pole is a good argument for a sphere...one good argument for sphere vs plenty of good arguments for a flat earth. goodnight anons
>>702893271 So... if Kansas isn't both parallel with sea level AND basically perfectly flat... how does this in any way prove anything about the curvature of the earth? You're literally just pointing to a random geological formation at this point. The globe doesn't necessitate that no flat surfaces occur anywhere. Congrats, you found a big flat slab.
Explain time zones, about how it can be day on one side of the Earth and night on the other. Explain solar eclipses. Explain auroras. Explain the oceanic horizon(sun going under the horizon in the evening, ships disappearing beyond the horizon, etc.) Here is a doable test, anon - get a weather balloon, strap a highly padded camera on it, remote balloon popper, fill it with hydrogen, release it, have it take video of the high atmosphere(almost space), pop it, look at the footage. Boom
>>702893584 >>702893683 I don't want to anymore, honestly. What I just had to read put a really, really bad taste in my mouth. What I see are sudden >haha wow what a retard >I don't even know what he was talking about >hey guys look >loook hahaha kek >water has nothing to do with atmosphere
Let me say it, but watch it be immediately hand-waved:
>water in a glass is a small model of an ocean in the sea basin >water in a glass is analogous to air within the gravity well of Earth >an ocean in the sea basin is analogous to air within the gravity well of Earth >light as waves and light as particles behave differently in different mediums >i.e. radiation, enthalpy, conduction, diffusion, incedence, translucency, etc >the physical behavior of light is that which allows the glow of a sunset >after the sun has set
>it is why the sky is blue >it is why objects in water bend >because the object is not bending >but the light is bending
>light bending is valid to mention because some argue that the world is round >if the world is round, then discrepancies in height plus a roughly spherical surface >must allow for varying lines of sight >if this can be observed >what does that mean
I really, really... really, really, really, really really really really can't break down why my telling you to literally take objects and recreate things for yourself is hard to understand.
It's like telling a 4 year old how to pick up a plastic cup, and then put it back down. Just take the cup.
>>702883061 Because if the earth is flat, then everything falls down towards it obviously - Things do not just friggin' stay in the air by themselves, do they? Basic physics. The theory of gravity DEPENDS on the world being round and everything being pulled towards it's center mass. If the earth is flat, we don't need gravity for things to fall downwards. So long as it has weight, it'll fall down if nothing supports it - Not because it is being pulled by a gravitational force but because it simply cannot fucking fly or levitate.
/honestly love it a few years back we were tripping nuts for days and put together a list of things to disprove with random quotes from look hes a dr from ----uk total bs and you know you start to beleve your own fib
/fast forward to present day now kids are posting stuff like omg you name it ups is a cover up and aliens in my computer built the mtv AND the earth is flat be cause i know a dr from ------the uk says so.
watch my gay video that proves i have an iq of 70 beacuse 70 is the new 125 because one two or five are of corse a lie that the government use to make money from ------uk scientist -----that prooves i know more than everyone including but not limited to and or jesus crist who as you know is the -----uk scientist acording to mark 8,008 s
most people -----dont want to think that everything they were told that is not this is a fals lie to get a free psp on a global fals flag govment
Anyhow, OP you cockgobbling slobbering mongoloid shitsmearing fucknugget cum bubble, if the earth was flat, gravity would force everything to fall to the center of mass, thus making it round again. The further you would be from the middle the more intense the incline would feel. Now fuck off with this garbage you're polluting my /b/, this is a place for extreme cancer only.
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