>USA economy >GDP is at an all time high >People keep
The stories and information posted here are artistic works of fiction and falsehood.
Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact.
Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact.
>USA economy
>GDP is at an all time high
>People keep saying economy sucks
Please explain to a econ simpleton what's wrong.
>>698081299
we're due for another financial crisis pretty soon
>>698081299
the US is used to economic growth. the economy is growing at like 2% . that sucks
>>698081299
whenever someone is in the white house, everyone from the other party will say we're either midway through hell or about to enter.
the growth rate also isn't stellar rn, but after like 5-7 years of straight growth it's not a massive concern to me
>>698081513
2% growth per year doesn't look like much.
But that means that every generation (generation = about 25 years) is 64% richer than the previous one.
That doesn't seem terrible.
>>698081299
>>People keep saying economy sucks
FOX news and right wing talk radio.
>>698081474
No, we're not. It is hilarious how people keep going on and on about how "past performance does not guarantee future results", yet somehow fail to realize that this applies to both bull and bear markets.
>>698081993
>But that means that every generation (generation = about 25 years) is 64% richer than the previous one.
Nope, just means avg prices/wages etc have increased that much.
2% growth is not that much. But the largest concerns are purchasing power which has gone down, wages have stagnated, and people exiting the workforce.
>>698082131
Have you seen the real unemployment numbers? The ones the WH tout are who are currently looking for a job that month. It's very low because that few are trying anymore. Actual employment is at some of its highest levels in years. Most of the jobs gained in the last 8 were Service industry (Food, hotel) and Medical (because the expansion of Obamacare into law.) Obamacare keeps failing and we've been seeing lots of drop offs of jobs in the Medical sector. It will only get worse in the next few years. The Housing Market has shifted right back into the same bubble it was a few years ago when it was subprime mortgage lending. When the Fed raised interests rates .5% from their current historic lows, the stock market dumped 3000 points in days. There is no solid ground for our current economy.
>>698081299
the next three & a half years are going to be terrible OP & it won't start to get any better until 2020....
>>698082917
>wages have stagnated
To a point, yes. But it's also keeping down higher inflation. The people demanding $15 an hour jobs don't realize that everything goes up in cost as a result to make that a reality. That's called inflation. Take California where $15 is pretty common, the housing market is so expensive that many only live in apartments or multiple generations under one house roof. Food and gas both have higher costs while other resources (water, power) have become highly strained with the influx of more people moving to California for those $15 jobs. Cali is on the edge of bankruptcy.
Everybody keeps talking about how bad the economy is but I've been working at the same job since 1987 and my life hasn't changed a bit. Same house, same wife, same kids. I really think the only thing that I pay a lot more for, that has really outpaced the growth of my wages, is medical insurance. My employer provided insurance was free until 2000 when it started skyrocketing every year after that.
I'm pretty sure "the economy" only effects rich people and investors.
The economy does suck, that's why interest rates have been at zero percent for almost a decade.
A healthy economy could handle 3-5% easily, but that would destroy us right now.
>>698083810
This is kind of right. But interest rate is a tool used by the fed to try to control psychology, and they've painted themselves out of being able to control it. Now any time someone even hints they might raise rates, the stock market starts freaking out and they have to back off. If they actually raised rates, everyone would pull out to wait and see what happens, which would start a downward spiral.
>>698081299
explained simply
where is the money
who has it to trade it
how often do they get more to keep trading it
after you figure that out ask yourself again if it is an all time high
>>698081299
When was the last time you had a raise anon? Or your dad?
Also fuck store fronts
It's more than a tool to control psychology
Ideally, it's the rate at which savers and borrowers balance out, but our country has very few savers (half of population lives paycheck to paycheck) and loads of borrowers.
So interest rates should be much, much higher. The reason they can't go higher is because our economy is dependent on cheap borrowing. If we had to borrow at even 1% higher, the game would be up. This is what these millennials don't understand about social welfare programs, they think the money is coming from other people, but it's actually coming from their future selves.
>>698081299
20 trillion in debt, 95 million people out of work, lower median income than 8 years ago, more people on welfar and food stamps than 8 years ago, money being printed to inflate the economy, weak dollar, lower credit rating, no longer largest economy. Want more? I've got plenty
>>698084866
Oh, and Obama is the first president to not see growth greater than 3%. He also accumulated more debt than all past presidents combined.
>>698084866
more please
>>698084599
Me july 1st.
My dad has his own business (dentist) and is a landlord.
Not enough money is circulating through the middle and lower classes, most of it is being captured by wealthy institutions.
There's no easy fix for this, because apparently rich people don't pay their taxes and you can't force them to pay employees more
My recommendation is global economic reform under a horizontalist socialist revolution
>>698085885
Wealthy institutions dont capture anything. They reinvest in research, or capital, or they put their money in a bank which is used to give loans. Or they put their money in the market which is used to bolster smaller companies and stabilize commodities. Learn how to capitalism.
>>698085885
Rich people pay the majority of taxes collected. Someone earning less than 50K a year pays very little, if any, taxes.
Your recommendation of buzz words won't help.
Circulation of money is not the problem. To increase standards of living, to actually increase wealth, you need to increase productivity. This is true on the personal level, just as much as the societal level. Most poor people produce very little.
>>698086249
Those institutions are engaged in such nepotistic insular practices that the money is de facto captured
>>698085885
Rich people are the only ones who pay taxes. And an employee is only worth what it costs to replace them. Regardless of industry, regardless if they have a family or obligations that arent the employers fault. If theres a stack of applicants that are 2illing to accept a lower wage, thats what your job is suddenly worth. Supply/demand
>>698085885
>My recommendation is global economic reform under a horizontalist socialist revolution
Alright, Bernie. Take your hyperbole and examine the effects socialism has on macroeconomics -- remember, Europe even as a "Unified" federation has a small role on the world stage thanks to Thatcher and her socialist ideologies.
Socialism is a precursor to collectivization. You can label it democratic socialism or horizontal socialism, it's still socialism. It still slowly robs the working class and leeches those earnings to an oligarchy of wealthy elite.
And before you start throwing around "But Police and Firefighters and the Weather Channel etc etc", most of those public services are privately owned and managed. Particularly firefighting and climate prediction services; they go up for auction every 5 years or so.
Europe has, to my knowledge, state-owned police, but their police can't stop mass-raping refugees either.
>>698086303
This graph shows you how fucking wrong you are. Your faith in the economy is entirely misplaced
>>698086813
That figure literally looks like it was made in MS Paint.
>>698081474
I've been hearing that since 2010...still waiting.
>>698086806
shut the fuck up idiot, there's no elites in horizontalism
>>698086500
Even if that were true, which its obviously just a bitter conjecture, but even if ut were true that money still gets reinvested all across the economy. The rich dont swim around in a silo full of gold coins like scrooge mcduck, they use that money to continue growing production, which os the basis of our economy.
>>698086949
so? it's from the bureau of labor statistics.
>>698087048
>shut the fuck up idiot
Found the first year college student.
Either that or your a Bolshevik mongrel, trying to feign responsibility your people inflicted upon Ukraine for the collectivization that murdered millions.
Probably both I'll wager. You think Socialism and Communism are so pretty and perfect.
>>698086813
I have no idea what that graph is trying to demonstrate, but our productive capacity has fallen compared to the rest of the world.
Look at any of these jobs reports, and at the top you see things like...
- temp workers
- government workers
- health and education
- retail services
At the bottom, you'll see manufacturing.
GDP means shit. If you want a middle class, you need them to be productive, and even if they collect a good paycheck as a government employee, that's not a productive job.
>>698081299
It's all fake!!!
Most jobs being created are part time without benefits
We are at a 75 year low of home ownership
They are giving 0.0% down home loans to try and get people buying houses to pay property taxes
Housing market will crash again soon
McCarthybots don't get a (you) from this point out
there are plenty of criticisms of capitalism, criticisms of the criticisms and so on, we don't have to argue about the soviet union anymore
we can try to make things better, because the market won't.
>>698087194
See:
>>698087285
And read about Margaret Thatcher's homocide of the United Kingdom's steel industry.
>>698081299
going third world country soon
>>698081299
No one gives a fuck about the underemployed/Unemployed poor. There are tens of millions of them but even the liberals look past them and pretend everything is running just smoothly.
As if a bit of welfare is enough to deal with the growing imbalance.
>>698087603
many places in the USA already resemble the third world, the only thing keeping people from starving is food stamps
>>698081299
The people who are saying that are the people with low education and shit jobs. For them, the economy does suck, that doesn't mean there's a problem.
>>698087734
our society can't typically weather millions dying at once, people who are starving will fight to the death first
>>698081299
Wages have been stagnant since the 2008 crash. All that recovery has gone straight to Wall Street and nowhere else.
>>698082782
>>698086954
Actually, we're right in the middle of the crisis.
Since the last happening, 2008, measures have been taken to contain its outfall.
Just a few hints:
- EU almost stagnant
- China with slowing growth
- massive debt in banking sector (Deutsche Bank and Commerzbank on the brink of bankruptcy)
- growing poverty all around
Adding to this that the US is losing power globally, very likely teading to an end to the Petrodollar in the foreseeable future. If the petrodollar goes down the drain, the US economy will collapse, taking the rest of the world with it.
I wonder how hunter gatherers paid for their stuff without money
>>698087854
They're not going to fucking die, there's a welfare system. They're just not going to leave the trailer park anytime soon. Jesus, this is so stupid I'm probably just getting trolled but whatever, I've got time right now.
>>698083588
Wages have stagnated, but the market inflation hasn't. It wouldn't be a problem if inflation stops. The middle class is facing less and less purchasing power as it is.
>>698081299
What's wrong is the government isn't giving me enough money to stimulate the economy by creating more jobs by having more money to spend.
There is no trickle down effect. Government needs to spread the wealth so everyone has money to spend, otherwise poor people create poor people which create entire poor neighborhoods which create entire poor cities because nobody has the money to pay each other to make or do what needs to be done.
>>698081299
like 12 people total are doing really well and everyone else is in debt to them
>>698088344
you mean the welfare system that's under constant attack by both american political parties?
clinton I did welfare reform
obama did stuff that made social security look underfunded
>>698083608
Your having the same job since before 2008 means you haven't had to face the historically difficult experience of finding a reasonable job as a new college graduate in today's market.
>>698088430
>poor people create poor people
That has to be the simplest yet most ingenious way I've ever heard the economy summarized.
Of course... if Person A is too poor to pay Person B, then person B is poor too. If millions of people are Person A...
>>698084866
/thread
Pack it in, boys.
if the private sector ever stepped up once throughout history, we probably wouldn't be so reliant on the government.
the government is a symptom of the failures of capitalism
>>698084963
not eating the shit sandwich in 2008 wasn't an option. you would've had the same thing with mccain. the president isn't omnipotent
>>698086249
The economy sine 2008 is irrefutable proof that trickle-down economics doesn't work. The extra money just gets transferred overseas as has been revealed by the Panama Papers leak.
>>698088430
>>698088603
Yep, If I had even just upper middle class money I could put half the poor people in my town to work just mowing my lawn, walking my dogs, sucking my dick, etc.
>>698088546
So what are you saying then? Millions of Americans are going to die of starvation in the near future? You're probably exactly the type of person I'm talking about. You deserve your life.
>>698084963
He inherited the worst economy since the Great Depression.
The private sector was over leveraged. The only thing that could be done to keep the ship afloat is to leverage up the public sector so the private sector could deleverage.
>>698088430
And it's blacks who should get all of this money when the government hands it out to stimulate the economy, because they never got the mule and 40 acres they were entitled to when they were freed as slaves.
>>698086303
>Someone earning less than 50K a year pays very little, if any, taxes.
That is flatout wrong. The average American gets like 40% of their net income taken out by taxes. In fact, income taxes are lower for the rich than they are for everyone else.
It's a trick, well sort off
You see: this is a well calculated stategy the is keeping many economies in a state of stagnancy
>media is paid off to report that the economy is dead
>when they do the day traders sell
>owners buy their own stock for cheap and resell for high lining their own pockets
>now it's likely if they are any of the Fortune 500 they'll run a shell company and barrow money against themselves purchase the stocks then default
>the government will cover the losses
There's more intricacies than that but effectively they can repeat this process as needed keeping money trapped on walstreet and consistently putting all new money there as well
>>698088764
actually, the modern nation-state was a way to stop the protestants and catholics from slaughtering each other in the 1600's
>>698086303
>To increase standards of living, to actually increase wealth, you need to increase productivity.
That is totally wrong. The average worker has increased their productivity year over year for decades, and nothing has come of it except all-time high corporate profits.
>>698084963
I'm sorry, but you are confusing the debt bush created with obama
>>698089139
Our country has already spent 10's of billions (literally, seriously, look it up) of tax dollars on the low-income black areas in this country, and it has been nothing but an absolute disaster.
Give a typical urban black man two million dollars, he'll be broke in a few months. Bling bling, bentleys, dope...
>>698085885
socialism can't exist without dystopia. the first asshole to abuse his powers instantly makes it communism. idiots
>>698089132
which is also fucked because the only reason the banks got so far into the red in the first place was because they knew they could force the government to bail them out in the end
the moral hazard to end all moral hazards
>>698081299
See: inequality
Almost no one is reaping any benefits from the economy. GDP doesn't really tell you anything about the actual health of the economy.
>>698086249
today you learned how big of a fool you really are
>>698086806
>Socialism robs the working class and leeches those earnings to an oligarchy of wealthy elites.
>pretending that isn't exactly what is currently happening in the US under capitalism
>>698081993
You're 12 and retarded.
>>698089405
blowing your money on bling bling and bentleys is actually good for the economy, because it increases demand. say what you want about the morality of welfare, but that money goes right back into circulation. it's the money the rich get that vanishes forever to the british virgin islands
not many ghetto nigz with swiss bank accounts
if the purpose of capitalism is to make a few people rich at the expense of other people, why don't we call communism capitalism?
>>698089644
dubs of truth
>>698081299
MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN™
>>698089794
because no one gets rich under communism
>>698089872
stalin looked pretty well off
>>698089644
stop arguing semantics, then "that's the wrong word for this blah blah"
Let us unite under the fact that we equally dislike a system which robs the working class and leeches their earnings to increase the wealth of parasites.
Whatever we call it, that is the thing we hate.
>>698083014
as that is the numbers everyone has used since WWII it's what is comparable.
There was no correlation between the FED raising and the DOW correcting.
Compared to the Eurostoxx 50 they are up 20 % this year alone, mostly because Europe actually did the austerity that the republicans said the US should have done...
>>698088319
You can't argue with the quality of life increases an economy with incentives has given us.
>>698086813
correct
>>698088344
I thought unemployment only lasted 2 years? Am I missing something. A fuck ton of people starve to death or die of exposure in the US each year.
>>698089490
Socialism doesn't require a dictator.
>>698090066
> Farming brought a population explosion, protein and vitamin deficiency, new diseases and deforestation.
>Human height actually shrank by nearly six inches after the first adoption of crops in the Near East.
>Not only had hunter-gatherers enjoyed plenty of protein, not much fat and ample vitamins in their diet, but it also seems they did not have to work very hard.
>The Hadza of Tanzania “work” about 14 hours a week, the !Kung of Botswana not much more.
oh yeah?
>tfw no qt track cycling gf
>>698089356
You summed it up perfectly, anon. This is literally exactly what Wall Street is doing right now.
>>698089708
>>698089993
Fair enough.
>>698090915
I'm going to call the proposed system "vote-style work togetherism"
basically, we're all equals, we all vote to come to decisions, and above all we work together
>>698089490
>capitalism can't exist without dystopia. the first asshole to abuse his powers instantly makes it corporatism. idiots
If you can't catch your own fallacy, kys
>>698090538
>being this off topic
MFW I'm a rich fag, S&P500 just hit an all time high, but both my parents died in the last 6 months and no friends.
>>698091199
i hope you're not amongst those up against the wall
>>698089993
The problem is in the semantics. People are applying nonsense ideas to socialist policy because "hurr durr red scare," then voting for capitalist policy that is what is actually doing what they say socialism would do.
The problem is that it is ALL about semantics because the past 60 years of media has turned Americans into politically-uneducated bumbling retards.
>>698091199
It must be hard being rich and without worry if you can pay the bills despite working fulltime. If you're going to fuck the American people in the ass, at least have the decency to not complain about stupid shit.
>>698091376
sounds like you should join the vote-style work togetherist party
>>698091087
So an unrealistic situation where no one is greedy?
>>698091418
I don't work anymore. I live of my rental properties and dividend income I get from my stock portfolio.
I don't see how I fuck Americans in the ass though.
>>698081993
Not when the inflation rate is closer to 3%. In reality, the economy is losing value at approximately 1% each year.
Nominal value =/= Real value
>>698081299
>very high unemployment
>very little real economic growth
>fed can not raise interest rates at all without crashing wall street
>spend spend spend!
yeah, looks fine to me.
>>698091490
I'm in the "Why don't we have death penalties for corruption bribery and treason and March around DC with the heads of CEOs and politicians on Pike's" party.
>>698091580
hey, if people are greedy and won't vote-style work together, what responsibility are we under to work with them or listen to their votes?
>>698081299
People are saying the economy sucks because wage growth is stagnant and lagging behind.
GDP gains are largely going to corporations and the wealthy (as they are more likely to invest in companies and reap returns).
>>698091418
Some would say money is stupid shit. It's not like rich celebs kill themselves eh? Maybe you're looking for love in all the wrong places. I'm a poor fag who works all the time on my 13th day today but I'm happy. Much happier then friends I know who have more money.
>>698091700
Fed raises rates in december 2015 -> S&P @ 2050
S&P500 today @ 2180
>Crash
>>698081299
Hu dat blond ball drainer?
>>698091647
rentierism is toxic to the economy
you've become a vampire with your exploitative capital
that's why capitalism is so evil, the greatest you can aspire to is to become vampirelike
>>698081299
this little figure, pictured
gdp isnt an accurate representation of how well "regular people" are doing
watch sanders vs greenspan 2003
>>698091958
Hege Bøkko, a Norwegian long-track speedskater
>>698089404
No. Bush accumulated more debt than any president before him. Obama has accumulated close to twice that of Bush through his policies alone. This does not include the policies that will begin to take affect after he is out of office. Bush was bad, Obama is worse.
The only problem with the American economy is the leeches who want something for nothing and don't understand how it is detrimental to the economy. While also having unskilled entry level labor demanding higher pay for a job meant for high schoolers instead of going out and getting an in demand job that takes minimum training and or education. I personally make about 4k a month not much but still a half decent pay check and all it took was a month of paid training.
>>698091723
because that would threaten vote-style work togetherism. vote-style work togetherists must be above reproach, above punitive violence.
punitive violence does not pacify, it only incites reprisal
>>698089708
Except that the people at bentley and who make and sell the bling are rich and/or overseas and put it in their swiss bank accounts.
>>698089216
>40%
Either you'really retarded or trolling. Not a single thing you said was true. Taxes are not some magical beast that is only known to a few and assessed to the masses. Tax equations are found with a simple search. At 50k the average single person pays about 19%, head of household about 13%. You mean to tell me those people have no deductions and pay 21%-27% in state taxes and social security.
>>698084502
Yeah these idiots who think the stock market which is getting free money trillions actually is the real economy. Employment is way down people spending is way down. It's the same all over the world right now.
>>698092495
sounds like you're advocating for massive economic reforms that would bring that productive stuff home
sounds like you're ready for vote-style work togetherism
>>698088466
>implying it was gay before
>>698091199
I'll be your friend. I only ask for tacos.
>>698092500
I pay nearly a third of my income to state income tax. In all, I pay a little over half of my yearly income in taxes.
>>698088826
>>698089404
You guys might be retarded... he did what every nigger does, and put us into debt we cannot overcome. The housing market created by laws passed during the Clinton administration put us at the top of the bubble in 2007-8 and the OPEC scandle pulled the last straw holding up our marbles. Bush borrowed a few billion for the fake war on terror, but Obama borrowed 5 times as much for literally nothing.
>>698083588
>That's called inflation
No it isn't, you stupid fuck. That's called wealth redistribution. It doesn't change the total value of a dollar because that money is coming from somewhere, preserving the vacuum.
Inflation is when more money is coming into the economy, diluting the overall amount of money available, diminishing savings accounts and PREVENTING wages from adjusting properly, not forcing them to do so.
The real "problem with the economy" is that Amerifags are dedicated to doing as little as possible for as much benefit as possible, and the rest of the world is finally dragging us down to sane levels of labor and income.
Side effect of the globalization we have pushed so hard for and benefit so much from. We can't resist hard work forever.
>>698092560
OP is not talking about the stock market. Hes talking about GDP, how much goods and services are produced on an annual basis.
http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?locations=US
>>698092560
Employment isn't down only unskilled employment is down which means you have to strive to become more then a whopper flopper to get a pay check and if you see that as a bad thing then you are the problem
>>698084866
[citation needed]
>overstates national debt
>oversimplifies 'number of people out of work' without accounting for babies, children, and retired people
>weak dollar
>lower credit rating
what the fuck are you on about nigger
>>698091916
How many times did the S&P close on something less than 2050 after that?Crash isnt the right word, but the fed has lost much of their control is what I was trying to convey. Nevermind that wall street =/= main street
>>698092706
Then you're a liar or mentally challanged. The tax code does not work like that. Nobody, literally nobody pays that much. You filled out something wrong or don't know how to fill out a tax return.
>>698092706
California is the highest state income tax at about 13%, and that only applies to the top earners. What the fuck are you talking about? This is an anonymous board. Lying to make a point doesn't sway anyone.
>>698081299
Wages are suppressed despite a "growing economy". I use the phrase "growing economy" because the growth is entirely based on an unsustainable debt model for the average citizen.
We're essentially veering the entire world into neofeudalism, but free speech allows us to call it as we see it.
>>698081299
Republicans through Fox News feed propaganda 24/7 about how bad everything is so they can get a racist moron into the Whitehouse to start wars all over the globe and bring about Armageddon.
>>698092320
>implying all the money going to corporations and private overseas accounts isn't a problem
>>698083014
>>698090064
Unemployment numbers do not include people who have been jobless for over 6 months.
Every respectable economist estimates real unemployment to be ~10-20% for all adults(excluding homemakers).
>>698092017
The point of a job is to make money, not to benefit society. I can help society apart from a job and I pay taxes on income which is used to support society.
It pisses me the fuck off when other people try to tell me that I have a duty to help society as part of my job. Excuse me but no I fucking don't. It is my life and if I can support myself without stealing or cheating anyone, I should be allowed to do that.
>>698093812
Your duty is to pay taxes and that's it. Tell those fans to fuck off.
Not sure you all understand the 95 million unemployement number. That's the total of working age people not working.
This includes parents staying at home to raise children, college kids, people in prisons and other institutions, etc.
If you want to use a number, pick a real one.
>>698092821
If that were true, why are there so many college graduates settling for shitty Starbucks jobs? You're full of shit.
>>698086806
>Thatcher
>Socialist
>Socialism leaches from the poor
Try again, fucko.
>>698081299
Trump has decided that the USA is broken and in a crisis. It's the biggest scam in history.
Incredibly enough people are falling for it.
>>698081299
It's because the average person isn't doing as well...wages are down and people have about $3,000-$4,000 less than ten years ago, with higher inflation (so less buying power). Also, there's a large number of people out of the workforce (unemployment numbers only count those collecting unemployment benefits, not those underemployed or unemployed but not collecting benefits). Many workers feel they are doing the work of 2 or more workers. If you're working, you're likely overworked. If you're not working, it's hard to get work.
>>698092821
And here we have true ignorance. You've literally got it backwards.
>>698081299
PAID CLINTON SHILL
ABANDON THREAD
PAID CLINTON SHILL
ABANDON THREAD
PAID CLINTON SHILL
ABANDON THREAD
Can you retards stop saying inflation? You don't know what inflation is.
Inflation rate is currently sitting around 1%. We had 15% inflation going into the 80s, and we've been fluctuating between 1% inflation and 5% inflation ever since.
Inflation is not simply "things being more expensive". It's a term related to how increases in money supply affect prices, and the money supply is not increasing that quickly.
Barack Obama will be the only U.S. president in history who did not deliver a single year of 3.0%+ economic growth.
"Assuming 2.67% RGDP growth for 2016, Obama will leave office having produced an average of 1.55% growth. This would place his presidency fourth from the bottom of the list of 39*, above only those of Herbert Hoover (-5.65%), Andrew Johnson (-0.70%) and Theodore Roosevelt (1.41%)"
>>698088301
This all day long
>>698081617
Obama shill detected.
>>698082131
shill detected
>>698094817
>>698083014
This. The housing bubble is a joke. I'm in Wyoming, and for a mid-sized house, I'm seeing prices at 250,000+. Non-renovated, shit holes in shitty neighborhoods.
>>698094522
Doesn't mean the GDP isn't high. Just because you're poor doesn't mean the country is too.
>>698095347
When considering if a country is poor, I take into account the average person.
>>698088319
Through their own labor while the smartest and most industrious got a little more and helped to make things better.
>>698095347
Of course...not arguing that the GDP is high. just explaining why people say the economy sucks. If the average person doesn't feel they can get ahead in the economy, they don't care what's happening on the macro level, they only feel the squeeze on their level.
>>698095462
Are there any peer-reviewed economic studies that support your idea? Name at least one Nobel Prize winning economist that agrees with you.
>>698081993
Except average inflation is 3% meaning if you grow 2% and the rest of the planet averages 3% you are actually at a net loss of 1%
>>698081299
>Please explain to a econ simpleton what's wrong.
The 1% are doing great. Stockbrokers who engage in microtrading are doing great. Everyone else is BADLY FUCKED, if you saved money for your retirement you are earning next to nothing on it. The "recovery" is a fucking JOKE, many millions of workers have given up looking for a job, what jobs there are do not pay well.
It's a good time to be a Jew.
>>698082648
you are retarded, we're due for another crisis because the banks are running the same derivatives schemes that caused 2008
>>698095869
I literally just told you it's my personal opinion. I don't need anyone to back me up.
>>698081299
Economy 101
GDP works good for a country but not for its citizens.
>>698086303
Except kids fam. Poor people on average have 5 kids because they too poor for birth control and rely on pulling out on their pull out couch for extra good luck.
>>698096406
The number of kids a couple has is effected by education levels and not economic status.
>>698094152
Because a lot of those graduates studied either shit tier gender studies or got business degrees with no safety net.
>>698095869
>valuing the nobel prize
ok obama voter
>>698096592
That's also bullshit.
>>698092320
What do you do anon?
>>698095536
we should go back to that.
no more richfags bleeding the community that created them for its money to buy useless shiny shit.
>>698094380
>the USA is broken and in a crisis
correct
>it's a scam
not correct
you are fucking retarded
>>698081299
the growth is not at an all time high, level of growth is low, profits are so unevenly distributed we have a record number of people on food stamps, all of the new jobs created are minimum wage &etc.
>>698094906
>the money supply is not increasing that quickly
lmao completely wrong, they're printing more money than ever
>>698081993
Like that money will filter down to average people.
>>698094380
...like this idiot here
>>698096808
cows defending the farmer on the way to the slaughterhouse
fuck this planet
>>698081299
its all fake I haven't made more money no trickle down economy here obama has made things worse with his stupid obamacare paying twice as much for mandatory insurance that I don't even use. Housing and stock market will crash especially if trump gets elected they will say it is his fault.
>>698084866
These dubs speak the truth.
While America is being bent over by the fed it's perpetually fucked.
>>698097139
>I haven't made more money
maybe because you browse 4chan all day instead of actually looking for a job?
>>698097109
you don't know anything about me, nor do you know anything about economics or politics or the jews or any of the other shit in play here
>>698086249
Look up fractional reserve lending then you'll see while the world is fucked.
>>698097339
>jews
i love it when retards disqualify themselves
>>698097109
lmao Clinton is supposed to start ww3 dummy, not Trump. why do you think the media and establishment are so against him? he's getting in the way of their decades-old plans
>>698097330
dumb ass im in real estate the market is crapping out inventory is low closing is over 45 days. I'm seeing more short sales pop up its all the same as last time most of the people are just to stupid to see it.
>>698085885
>rich people don't pay their taxes
there's more and more data leaks of tax evasion bank accounts, putting these bastards behind bars where they belong.
the hackers are on our side.
>>698097450
what do you know about Mossad m8? AIPAC? the IMF?
>>698097622
dubs don't lie
>>698088301
/thread.
Good night nurse
>>698097330
Oh fuck off. That's bullshit. You motherfuckers are like cows defending the butcher.
>>698097708
pardon me the BIS
>>698081299
rednecks dont understand a shit thats why politicians use economy as argument for bullshit
>>698089644
Pretending the US is capitalist
Social security
Unemployment benefits
Food stamps
Medicare/medicaid
Farm subsidies
Corporate subsidies
USA is socialist already, maybe that's why it's going to shit, faggot
If people think that the shit going down in Venezuela can't happen anywhere else more affluent you're fucking mistaken. At least the yanks have guns to defend themselves.
There will be a global crash in the next couple of years because all the banks are broke.
>>698081299
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPKKQnijnsM
USA economy sucks for most people
/thread
>>698081299
If you spend all day shuffling words around you can make anything sound bad... Morty.
>>698086813
>>698090183
Not correct.
Productivity can increase with hiring additional employees or even automation. and you can do both of those things without raising wages. hell, you can even lower em!!
the usa is doing far better than the rest of the world in almost all measures.. you cant just look at numbers in a vacuum. life isnt perfect
>>698098061
Jesus Christ, you have to be mentally handicapped. Social programs and safety nets to prevent class warfare are totally seperate entities from the economic design of the country. The US is a textbook example of capitalism.
>>698098479
I think that shows just how bad the global downturn is.
>>698088301
and AIG + the 4 other major health insurance companies are claiming losses this year well into the hundreds of millions.
AIG says it will be out of business in a year if nothing changes.
:\
>>698086954
>What is the student loan bubble?
>>698089993
Great idea Vlad, let's bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator. Business is a competition to survive, there is no green participation ribbon. In any group there will be people who assert themselves and lazy faggots that will always take the easy way and leach off of the alphas. Socialism is a survival mechanism for beta faggots.
>>698081474
thats everyones fear but reality is different not true
>>698098479
Life isn't perfect. One has to consider several things, and not just the USA's standing in relation to most of the world (especially because most US citizens are unfortunately blissfully unaware of the rest of the world). But there are the US's own standards...is the current economy and general welfare up to those? Do people feel the country is headed in the right or wrong direction? And do public perceptions match reality? Why or why not. Definitely more than just numbers if you're talking about general state of living--it's attitude, too.
>>698087660
>There are tens of millions of them but even the liberals look past them and pretend everything is running just smoothly.
Conservatives dont do that.
Trump's whole agenda is based off of not doing that.
but fuck Trump, he's more right than wrong when it comes to the average American job
>>698081299
Capital gains taxes are still at an all time low because "muh trickle down economics"
>>698098331
>>698099055
no because of the fucking recession.
you want the stock market to freeze, faggot?
>>698098331
top 1% owns 40% of all wealth
Bottom 80% own 7%
way to go USA
>>698099171
>>698099171
especially when "the stock market is at an all time high!!!" is the only thing this administration can tout and brag
>>698083014
You can blame the republican dominated supreme court at the time for allowing states to opt out of medicaid expansion with no penalty when Obamacare was implemented.
>>698096045
This.
>>698099079
I don't understand why you're facepalming at facts?
>>698099276
You can blame the constitution for allowing room for State rights...
And you can thank AIG for realizing the clusterfuck that expansions have caused, and are backing out of their state expansions by 2018
why do my parents say that i need a psichiatrist if they locked me in jail?
>>698099171
>stock market at an alltime high
>stock market freezing
Pick one or the other. We currently have option 1; therefore, option 2 isn't an immediate concern.
>>698099171
>no because of the fucking recession
LOL
>>698099573
lul, I'm giving you all my internets for today 10thamendmentbro.
>>698099456
because:
>>698099079
>>698098331
same guy
>>698096045
nigga gets it
>>698099651
if you were to raise capital gains taxes significantly, people would pull their money out of the stock market and put it somewhere that doesn't tax you as high. people wouldn't invest as heavily because now your returns aren't as appealing as they were. people wouldnt be willing to sell their homes for as cheap or as quickly, because youre gonna lose an additional portion right off the bat.
>>698100008
is this reality funny? read above first before you fail to understand economics.
you think the government isnt taxing the stock market because muh poor people need money? because companies need more money to pay for them poor???
no, its for companies to invest in themselves and each other for profit. profit benefits the government, potentially everyone maybe but you still need a company to start off with.
>>698081299
The economy is doing well. Unfortunately, that just means that the merchants (wealthy people and corporations) are doing well.
The average "joe" is still getting screwed.
It would be better for the average "joe" if less people voted republican. They are all about trickle-down -- which doesn't work when the wealthy close the taps.
>>698100706
so which company created the earth?
>>698100801
the fuck you say???
im taking this shit post at face value for the shit it's worth and assuming ive shut you up.
>>698100729
well, both parties are to blame, because republicans like trickle-down, and democrats like taxing and regulations on companies that stifle them...unintended result (politically) is less money gets to the workers. either way, the average joe is screwed.
>>698096025
>>698081299
It's pretty simple really... Low wages mean higher profits for corporations. The influx of illegal and legal immigrants into this country ensures that wages remain low because of supply and demand. Democrats want as many immigrants to come to this country so that they can vote for them, and Republicans want as many immigrants to come to this country so that they can profit from cheap labor. America is basically fucked when the house of cards come crashing down.
>>698098645
thanks
these people who "have no responsibility to society" are going to have a rude fucking wakeup when the economy fucks up bad enough to cause catastrophic social unrest
>>698092911
lol this
fucking republicans warping shit so it looks like obama fucked us all up. why do people even try to argue about politics here without citations.
>>698100008
>>698100008
nothing to say??? did >>698100706 cave in your false reality?
literally LOL worthy if you think any way our economy operates right now ISNT directly influenced by the recession....
>>698100376
No one cares.
>>698100706
>Implying lower-capital gains taxes has no way of allowing rent-seekers to gain more wealth. You're fuckin up buddy.
>>698081299
I knew jobs report just came out today. The US economy is doing fucking stellar especially compared to the awful depression that George Bush brought us into. Anything anyone else says is simply a lie against the fax. Sorry guys.
>>698081299
It's because a liberal is president and cuckservatives are having major cognitive dissonance that the economy isn't in tatters after 8 years of Obama.
>>698101728
"A new" sorry for the typo.
>>698100706
But what else is as lucritive as the US stock market? There isn't anything else for rich fags to turn to unless they like getting small returns in exchange for loaning money to the government.
>>698101728
Since wages suck, all that really means is you read a report that a bunch more busy little bees are making the rich richer.
>>698100376
Why are the British so fucking ugly holy shit.
>>698101134
this
>>698101072
You're partly right, but paying lower wages isn't the only way for business to maximize profits. As a matter of fact, with skilled labor it's usually the LAST thing they try to save money on so they can ramp production back up when the market demands it.
>>698084866
17 trillion in debt mostly due to unfunded wars started by republicunts and corporate welfare laws written by republicunts.
>>698085885
Nigger im in private banking in switzerland. All americans are getting fucked by IRS ROYALLY believe me they pay their taxes since 2008
>>698101323
I agree that republican presidents do most of the bad things, but democratic presidents are very destructive too
they're the good cops. they still arrest you and send you to jail, they just have a smile on their face and "your best interests at heart"
reagan - massive tax cuts to defund social programs
bush I - massive tax cuts, minor tax hike, net negative
clinton I - massive welfare "reform", really cuts
bush II - massive tax cuts, attempts to privatize social programs, left bloated social program as a poison pill (the medicaid drug program)
obama - defunded social security with his tax shenanigans, health care "reform" poison pill, appointed goldman sachs crypto-employees to positions in government, some have already gone on to join goldman sachs proper
clinton II - whats next?
BERNIE STEIN WARREN TRIUMVIRATE 2016
>>698101665
are you fucking kidding me??
yes lower capital gains are incentives for people to MAKE MONEY. like i just said, faggot.
just because theres a REAL reasons capital gains taxes are low, does not mean i have to address the fact that the economy is LOADED with rent seekers. its called deadweight loss and its going to happen in any free market.
jesus you guys get so wrapped up in one aspect of how this works you get confused and angry at the rest
>>698101134
This is the end game my nigga.
>>698101728
The problem is he average person isn't seeing any of tht stellar economy. The middle class is experiencing record income inequality and stagnant wages.
>>698101784
I'm liberal and I support Obama but we are still controlled by a corporate oligarchy.
And when that oligarchy is lobbying Congress to keep wages low, that's a problem.
>>698102186
just repeating history imo
>>698094380
spoken by a true democratic shill.
66% of people polled believe the country is headed in the wrong direction (see realclearpolitics), and Hillary's convention was singing kumbaya like there's nothing wrong. Trump overstates conditions (he's full of bluster on every subject), but the U.S. hasn't been making the right decisions in domestic or international policy for over a decade, and the path we're on is not a sound one.
>>698101874
Real estate. its real.
there are other countries and stock markets.
there are private companies that are not publicly traded. in other countries.
you can put your money in a lot of places and make money, especially if you already have a lot to begin with. if one of those places imposes an additional 10% tax... you'd be dumb not to move it around.
>>698081299
No jobs. Not stable economy. Mints are going in overload. Money's worth is falling. GDP is actually low. We aren't producing anything g
>>698102355
Raising the minimum wage and taxing Wall Street isn't a sound plan?
nigga wut
>>698102263
Yes but the economy is still doing well regardless. It's just that not everyone is benefiting from it doing well.
>>698102073
Yes we are. The IRS has its cock buried balls deep in the small business owner.
>>698102102
Reagan really fucked up by deregulating the financial sector and decreasing taxes on the wealthy from 70% to 40%. For some reason these free market fundamentalist believe that by leaving the financial market to their own accord, that they will have the people's best interest at mind. First thing you learn in Game Theory.
>>698102457
Then the economy really isn't doing as well as it could. Boom and bust aren't good indicators.
>>698081299
wages haven't kept up
>>698102532
let me guess a "small business owner" that makes a couple million a year
>>698102532
Not as much as the rich ones. Small ones are just not involved enough to protect their assets
>>698088585
Come to where I am and I guarantee you I can get you a job doing what I'm doing as long as you are 21, have a HS diploma, and no criminal record. 100% chance.
>>698102391
It seems like the solution is to restrict the transfer of money to domestic markets.
>>698102102
you're pretty good with your analysis except with Obama you're tinfoilly.
Why?
>>698081299
The problem is a poorly defined camel toe and no apparent nipples. Her blue eyes get points though.
>>698081299
ITT: pseudo-intellectuals and autistic teens argue about things they don't really understand
>>698102809
nigga she's only 12
>>698102444
this is a dead horse but i'll bite
minimum wage disproportionately affects smaller businesses.
yeah ok you'll be able to really piss of McDonalds and Walmart who can then either never give a raise past the new minimum, ever to anyone... or they can automate their services (fire employees), which they will,
but you will have totally and effectively gutted the future of mom and pop stores. imagine that little corner store in the city you go to.... you think they can just double the wages and afford the cost??
>>698102823
YOU SHUT UP FAGGOT
YOUR THE REAL RACIST
>>698086303
You are leaving out sales tax, property taxes, and social security tax--all three of which are regressive. People who have more oney pay more taxes in aggregate? That is only surprising if it's NOT true. If making less than 50k is so nice, why aren't more people giving up their fortunes until they reach that level of income?
>>698102786
aaaannddddd now youre a dictator. you just killed the free market, democracy, and the american dream all in one
>>698102662
Your experience does not reflect the market overall.
>>698102444
raising the minimum wage isn't as clear-cut and simple as most advocates like to paint it--you make companies pay more for their workers and they start to make cuts along the way (they don't want to make less profit). Wall Street needs better regulations than those that were passed. Not enough changed to prevent the kind of dealings that led to the last recession from happening again in another fashion.
>>698102853
If your business relies on near slave labor to keep the doors open, then you have a bad business model and you deserve to go bankrupt. Make room for someone who actually knows how to run a business.
>>698102853
no it isn't faggot
It's a common argument the oligarchy makes to keep wages low. It's not a troll, you aren't "biting" and you're talking shit if you're blaming government for someone's bad business plan.
>>698102853
It has to be a slow process, to allow small business to adjust their prices accordingly. You think just one day shit will jump from $7.50 to $15 an hour?
>>698081299
very easy:
people do not understand economics
>>698102660
Agreed. Not big enough to play the game but big enough to catch a cock in the ass.
>>698102850
So? It's not sexual assault to talk about somebody.
>>698102948
So taxing Wall Street isn't a form of regulation? Requiring businesses to pay realtime economic wages isn't regulating them?
>>698081299
>21 trillion shekelz in debt
>economy is great
fucking millennials
>>698096592
>Business degree with a safety net.
What does this even mean? No degree has a safety net anon.
>>698103166
you probably voted for Bush
Both Bushes. Twice.
>>698102823
I am a pseudo intellectual but also have a degree in economics from a top school.
me so far, AMA:
>>698098407
>>698099171
>>698099251
>>698100706
>>698102160
>>698102391
>>698102853
>>698103166
>muh 21 gorillion in debt
Caused by irresponsible right wing wars and corporate welfare.
>>698102947
And my experience could be your experience. I work in the casino field. There has not been as single day in the past 20 years we have not been hiring dealers not one day. There are jobs everywhere but everyone wants to do shit no one needs.
>>698103248
Why aren't you supporting Trump?
Because the world is actually so god damn stable that it's begun to stagnate.
>>698103308
Nobody wants to work for a bullshit establishment like a casino. They shouldn't even be allowed to exist.
>>698103291
8 years of socialist obama made it worse
only trump can fix this
>>698091087
You can't have the "work together and love each other" utopia if the people don't get a choice to self determine how they use their life and how they use the fruits of their labor.
>>698103102
I didn't say it wasn't a form of regulation. What I said was there weren't enough of the right regulations passed to prevent the ridiculous shit that led to the last recession from happening again. It's a merry-go-round. It's not just about taxing, but passing new laws that prevent unethical dealings like you see uncovered in numerous books, news reports, and now even movies like The Big Short.
>>698103376
>The Middle East
>Stable
kek
>>698103308
More like no one wants to do shit they deem themselves to be too good for. There are supermarkets in my town that are regularly hiring people. Some income is better than no income, but god forbid someone see them doing a shitty job.
>>698103458
>you think Trump is going to end corporate welfare and irresponsible war spending
K
E
K
>>698103458
your penis is too small to fix
>>698103391
Then starve.
I'd also like to add that for the economy being so bad people still seem to have a ton of money to gamble. Our craps tables are packed elbow to elbow every weekend with disadvantaged black youths.
>>698103593
Trump would play Good Cop while Congress plays Bad Cop and refuses to pass his "reforms."
>>698102054
I was referring to the aggregate effect it has on the entire economy. Imagine if there was no illegal immigrants, what would happen? Someone HAS to pick the fruits, mow the lawns, and clean the hotel rooms. If no American will work an entire day in 100 degree heat for $8, then the companies have to raise it to $10... $12... $15... $18... $20... Or however much it would take to fill the jobs right? Now this creates a domino effect because then a McDonalds worker making $8/hr would think, "Hey, I can move to California and work the farms for double what I'm making now and I can leave the ghetto." Then McDonalds will have to raise THEIR wages because their employees are leaving and it's more difficult for them to fill positions. Apply this to secretaries, truck drivers, janitors, and every other low and mid income positions, add it all up, and the wealth is redistributed NATURALLY through supply and demand.
>>698102853
Let's say the average small business only uses 25% of expenditures to cover wages. A 100% increase in wages only translates to a 25% increase in total expenditures. With the subsequent increase of local expendable income, I don't see it being that bad at all.
>>698103611
>>698103593
How can I join CTR and shill for money on 4chan?
>>698103662
Packed with gambling addicts, you mean.
Thanks for being party to a social ill.
>>698103523
>The entire rest of the fucking planet except for Africa
Lol.
>>698103742
First your penis has to be longer, although not as long as mine. :^)
Poast occasional screenshots w/timestamp and you will be contacted
>>698103014
to be faur, rhat is a byproduct, not an end goal. Henry Ford paid his assembly line workers $5 an hour--an unheard of wage at the time. In so doing, he created a market for his product. (By the way, he was a dick and thiught that those higher wages,eant that he deserved the 110% effort that most employers expect for diminishing wages right now). Wages arelow for several reasons...and not all good or fair ones. Executive compensation, and new tax laws that allow CEOs to deduct salary in excess of 1 million if it is earned based on performance (quasi-citation: see Economic Policy Institute website for their paper on low wages). You want higher ages? Say "no." If they find someone else to do it...the job fucking sucked and now you know. Join or form a union. At least honk your horn when you see a picket line.
>>698102939
If I'm elected, it's not killing democracy. If this economy is the result of the free market, maybe it's time for a change. How is trying to stop runaway income inequality against the American Dream. It's already dead.
Because this
>>698103004
>>698102994
deciding to pay your shelf stockers/pizza delivery boys only $8 or $10 an hour is not a bad business plan...
and how is it a common argument (implying lie) by the oligarchy?? you think every business actually has double the amount of money to fund double the amount of wages? have you ever worked at a real business? big corps like Walmart will.... but
>>698103014
fuck you and your ignorance. lets say it takes 5 years. gov't: "ok mom and pop, in 5 years you need to be able to afford double the cost in wages. good luck". at this rate of the economy, they will just fire half the employees
this whole thread is literally talking about how relatively stagnant the economy is growing, and you think we're on the path to doubling revenue for small businesses in less than a decade. youre insane. that's why there are almost NO politicians actively pushing for $15 an hour.
>>698103865
Russia isn't stable, either. Neither is much of South America.
And the US is only "stable" because of our service economy.
>>698081299
Lots of people pissed off because you can't find factory jobs anymore. People want factory jobs.
Too bad you cannot base a modern economy on factory jobs any more. Trying to force the society back to the fifties isn't gonna work.
>>698103993
So you're just going to be a total faggot about paying workers more money the entire rest of the thread
k
>>698102994
Doubling payroll overnight will destroy thousands of businesses. How well will customers respond to paying substantially more for products/services?
Pretty much blows any "business model" out of the water.
>>698103993
If your business plan cannot handle wage increases, then you are a shit for brains who shouldn't be running a business.
>>698103308
I live a mile from a casino and have good customer service skills. But I am a pot smoker, and I know they would never hire me. Taje that for what it's worth.
>>698103890
Please contact me, I will accept shekelz.
Unless you have a huge clit I doubt your floppy vagina is larger than my penus. So I think I qualify.
I'm also willing to change my last name to Goldcohenberg to join your shilling club.
>>698103376
It's amazing how utterly simplified and wrong that is.
>>698103993
The problem is your entire post is just your opinion, and based on speculation and supposition.
inb4 a bunch of right-wing econ blogs that agree with me
>>698103586
There's no such thing as a job no one wants. It just doesn't pay enough. Would you be a doctor if it paid $12/hr? The same concept applies here on a lower scale. Because if the supermarket job paid $25/hr do you think people will be lining up for the job? If you apply supply and demand to everything then you'll have equilibrium.
>>698103998
>Russia isn't stable
Do go on.
>A diaspora of third world nations with zero effect on the global economy is poor too guys!
>>698103993
>that's why there are almost NO politicians actively pushing for $15 an hour.
Except the party currently winning the election right now
>>698103458
You do realize Bush added way more debt than Obama, right?
>>698104099
what??
it's called the individual business knows how much they can afford, and thats it; government forcing peoples hands will just make big corps mad and run small corps out of business.
I cant find a good article of it, but an example is when we passed the ACA and Papa Johns shifted half of their employees to part-time to avoid paying for full-time insurance benefits.
see what im saying??
>>698104215
firing people to adjust for revenue is a reasonable and common part of a business plan.
>>698104341
Truly. I imagine it was so mind-boggling that you couldn't even piece together a coherent refutation.
>>698104279
Also you cannot criticize Jewish people or say "nigger" or "spic." So I believe you are disqualified. :^)
And I have a huge cock, not a vagina. ADD /pol/tard is ADD.
>>698104418
oh fuck just say "shitskin" and get it over with
>>698103662
Gambling is addictive, dumbass. The city I live in has a huge casino but is also crippled on the local economy level because people become addicted and blow all their money in the casinos.
>>698103993
Hey...if the minimum wage hadkept pace with inflation...it'd be $18/hour.
>>698104351
no.
read more please.
http://www.salon.com/2013/06/24/10_companies_that_threatened_to_cut_worker_hours_to_avoid_obamacare_partner/
im not going to scour the internet for you to see the day-to-day shit of businesses and how they react to policies but... try to imagine it happens ok? the real world keeps moving when you sleep, buddy
>>698104597
Oh my bad. Guatemala is a first world superpower. Sorry for being so god damn racist.
>>698103697
The only problem with that is unemployment only pays for two years or whatever it is, and everyone has to eat.
>>698104476
Actually Papa Johns is a company big enough to afford the changes, and the CEO was roundly criticized for being a selfish Teabagging fuck.
So you're biased. No one cares about your opinion from now on.
>>698104440
you're wrong
http://useconomy.about.com/od/usdebtanddeficit/p/US-Debt-by-President.htm
