'Murican history skills.
The stories and information posted here are artistic works of fiction and falsehood.
Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact.
Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact.
'Murican history skills.
>>693225296
You don't have a Chinese flag. We funneled them a lot of money and fighter pilots before Pearl Harbor.
>>693225296
>Britain not half dead and begging for US help
They almost were accurate.
>>693225296
>muh pearl harbor
>let's throw a nuclear bomb to civilians
>heroes
>>693225790
>not knowing that not dropping a nuke would have prolonged the war by years, therefore killing more people..
C'mon buddy...think abit before you take the cock out of your mouth.
>>693225790
War changes.
>>693226072
well said
>>693225296
if anyone really thinks this is what liberal public school system teaches then you would be really wrong, they teach us that the USA sneaks in at the end and helps a little. stop trying to think your edgy and hipster and different you skateboard riding twot
eh, how americans view WW2 isnt that bad when you consider how bad they seem to misremember WW1. WW2 was won in a big part thanks to them, WW1 was literally them showing up at the last minute, accomplishing very little, and taking all the credit.
>>693226072
*claps*
>>693225790
that was just the US flexing its teenage dick to the world
>>693225790
All it takes is one obscene display of power and lack of empathy to pave the path to an empire built on fear.
Your complaining about bombing civilians and your tired old 'muh ___' jab at one of the world's leading superpowers just makes you look like a liberal SJW. Either cite your reasons with factual and reasonable evidence or don't pick a side at all.
>>693226072
Implying the Japanese hadn't already tried to surrender and the US said 'lul nope', dropped the nukes and accepted their surrender the next day. We did it because we wanted to not because we had to
>>693226365
But the US brought an end to WW2..did it not?
>>693226522
i would say russia really brought an end to ww2
>>693226135
the fuck you say?
>>693226416
Too late...maybe they should have though about that b4 they attacked us for no reason?
>>693226416
We also dropped flyers warning civilians that the bombs were coming (in their language), explaining the reason that the bombs were being dropped, and telling them to vacate.
>>693225296
And? Is somebody supposed to care?
>>693226135
War never changes, newfag
>>693226701
You serious?
>>693226625
On the western froNT, yes. But what about japan?
the Japanese were wining in most of the fights with the u.s and never would have stopped
>>693226671
>no reason
lol xD japawanese so random
>>693226660
>memes
>>693226796
This is true though.
>>693226796
Yeah, Google that shit, man. The translation of it was really... almost like a disappointed parent explaining tough love. I feel like there's a word for it, but I lack the vocabulary. I'm sorry.
>>693226844
You made me laugh you JERK
>>693226844
OK so we gave aid to China? Big shit?
>>693225790
They were the military industrial cities and the US begged the citizens to evacuate beforehand
>>693226810
i don't think japan was all that pivotal in ww2 to be honest. i mean they dragged the us into the fight. however its possible that US would have gotten involved regardless
>>693226934
I will, thanks for teaching me, teacher.
>>693226271
Unsure where you get this perspective, US involvement in WWI is not overly emphasized when being taught in school; WW2 definitely though.
>>693225790
Don't start a fight you can't win faggot
>>693227129
most didn't evacuate thinking it was a joke because they didn't know how powerful the nukes were
>>693227226
They teach WW1 in your school? Mine didn't.
>>693227226
We did show up really late in ww1, we had an isolationist policy back in ww1.
>>693225790
apart from the prolonged effects of radiation the US did a shit ton more damage and killed more people in just normal bombings.
>>693226072
Some people argue that it was actually the Soviets declaration of war on Japan that prompted Japan to surrender. Seriously look up how much damage Japan took in US bombings not including the Atom bombs. They didn't give two shits about getting bombed. they did care about ending up in a Soviet Gulag though.
>>693225296
Stalin emptied his prisons and conscripted them. We supplied them almost 100%. Win/Win until oh shit iron curtain.
>>693227187
Possible yes. Likely, eh. Maybe, maybe not
>>693226796
TO THE JAPANESE PEOPLE:
America asks that you take immediate heed of what we say on this leaflet.
We are in possession of the most destructive explosive ever devised by man. A single one of our newly developed atomic bombs is actually the equivalent in explosive power to what 2000 of our giant B-29s can carry on a single mission. This awful fact is one for you to ponder and we solemnly assure you it is grimly accurate.
We have just begun to use this weapon against your homeland. If you still have any doubt, make inquiry as to what happened to Hiroshima when just one atomic bomb fell on that city.
Before using this bomb to destroy every resource of the military by which they are prolonging this useless war, we ask that you now petition the Emperor to end the war. Our president has outlined for you the thirteen consequences of an honorable surrender. We urge that you accept these consequences and begin the work of building a new, better and peace-loving Japan.
You should take steps now to cease military resistance. Otherwise, we shall resolutely employ this bomb and all our other superior weapons to promptly and forcefully end the war.
EVACUATE YOUR CITIES.
>>693227397
same we have holocaust study's as an elective though never took it
>>693225296
Fix it.
>>693226796
ATTENTION JAPANESE PEOPLE. EVACUATE YOUR CITIES.
Because your military leaders have rejected the thirteen part surrender declaration, two momentous events have occurred in the last few days.
The Soviet Union, because of this rejection on the part of the military has notified your Ambassador Sato that it has declared war on your nation. Thus, all powerful countries of the world are now at war with you.
Also, because of your leaders' refusal to accept the surrender declaration that would enable Japan to honorably end this useless war, we have employed our atomic bomb.
A single one of our newly developed atomic bombs is actually the equivalent in explosive power to what 2000 of our giant B-29s could have carried on a single mission. Radio Tokyo has told you that with the first use of this weapon of total destruction, Hiroshima was virtually destroyed.
Before we use this bomb again and again to destroy every resource of the military by which they are prolonging this useless war, petition the emperor now to end the war. Our president has outlined for you the thirteen consequences of an honorable surrender. We urge that you accept these consequences and begin the work of building a new, better, and peace-loving Japan.
Act at once or we shall resolutely employ this bomb and all our other superior weapons to promptly and forcefully end the war.
EVACUATE YOUR CITIES.
>>693226135
boys we have a synth!
>>693227404
the good old days of minding our own business.
>>693225296
why are there 4000 ussrs and not one big one
>>693227647
Yup. We had a nice "I don't fuck with you, you don't fuck with me attitude back then."
>germany is forced to pay ridiculous amounts of money to the allies instead of rebuilding itself and france
>germany says screw you and takes back territory it had before everyone starts fucking with it
>jews take advantage of the situation
>thrown into work camps and gassed
>big american and little russian dinosaurs comes stomping in to help the jews
>mfw not even 100 years later you're all owned by jews
>mfw my people are the evil ones who screwed up
Lol
>>693226408
The vast majority of us are just here to meme and shitpost. This isn't a great place to ask for citations, bro.
>>693227706
because russia basically just shoved its lower class into a meat grinder because they fucking suck asshole otherwise
>>693227466
Possibly, but that wasn't a guaranteed end to war. The nuke was.
>>693227706
USSR literally just had too many men.
>>693227404
Not denying that, the point of contention is that the previous poster believes the US typically takes credit for WW1 - my point was that we're not even taught much about it. Reading comprehension, anon.
>>693225296
Uh huh. Tyrannosaurus went extinct hundreds of years before WWII.
>>693228044
They shot their own soldiers for retreats.
>>693228169
I was taught alot about it. I had a good school though...
>>693227397
In US history, sure, but like I said it was barely covered unlike WW2. Think that was Sophomore history class in HS around the late 90s.
>>693227563
God damn. I have a hard on.
>>693228579
Or a bad school, depending how useful it was to be taught so much about WW1.
>>693228778
Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it...
>>693227932
Be careful. Your cucked, anti-any-sort-of-pride country makes the Swastika illegal. You dont want the police arresting you for having anything to do with something that gave the Germans hope and pride in themselves.
Now all the turks and syrians get to rape your Merkel and shit in your streets.
>>693228048
"On March 10, 1945, U.S. B-29 bombers flew over Tokyo in the dead of night, dumping massive payloads of cluster bombs equipped with a then-recent invention: napalm. A fifth of Tokyo was left a vast smoldering expanse of charred bodies and rubble.
Today, a modest floral monument in a downtown park honors the spirits of the 105,400 confirmed dead, many interred in common graves."
That's just one of the other bombing runs done months before any atomic weapons being used. I'm not saying atomic weapons didn't have an impact, but it just seems like Japan could care less about being bombed into the stone age.
we had this same thread yesterday
>>693229051
What an amazingly unoriginal canned response, learn that from your "good school"?
*how Americans think WW2 was
Us Aussies know Russia kicked ass by throwing bodies at them
>>693225296
Not to scale. The American T Rex should have a huge dangling dong.
>>693226416
Oh good, didn't realize it was Imaginary History Month.
>>693226072
Derp, dropping the Nuclear bomb was just a wink too Stalin
Hey Stalin, look what we got, you better chill now bra.
>>693228342
yup, russia was fucking retarded, if they tried to solo germany they would have run out of people to kill
>>693225790
Fucky you dirty red button nip monkey, Korea best Asian.
>>693229421
No. It's common fucking sense you autistic cock gobbler..I learn history so when retards like you decide you're allowed to speak, I can put your uneducated ass in your place.
ITT, Eurotrash bashing American education by bringing up what trolls bait them to believe we are taught.
>>693229125
It was the shock of that bomb that got them..before that, they had never seen a mushroom cloud before
>>693229629
And this.
>>693229926
Have you ever seen a mushroom tip dick?
I AM BIG CUMS
>>693226416
Do people really believe this is what happened, or am i getting baited?
>>693227706
Russian tactic= send out as many motherfuckers as you can and overpower the enemies by sheer number. And then shoot any Russian that tries to retreat... They legitimately got executed for retreating.
>>693229639
But germany tried to attack during the winter, no army in history has been able to invade Russia successfully in winter.
>>693230067
Kek
>>693227706
because it was actually a bunch of bloc armies under supreme command of commie leader
>>693229629
>>693228077
wow, those commie bastards had one shitty ass kill-death ratio
>>693229561
fuck off trump supporter
>>693230209
lol what do you think happened when it wasn't cold? they got fucked beyond belief, lol winter is the only thing they had going for them
>>693226416
whether the bombs were necessary is heavily debated among historians but literally no mainstream ones accept this narrative. it's on the level of believing that roosevelt knew Pearl Harbor would happen
>>693229125
Almost nobody really knew what an atomic bomb was at the time. There's a big difference between a normal raid and seeing a whole city wiped by ONE bomb.
They also had no idea how few atomic bombs we had... for all they knew, we could now party wipe their whole nation with these super weapons.
>>693225296
Other than America being awesome as hell, people view it this way because, while Russia had the huge kill count against the Nazis, it was with American studebaker trucks to transport everything they needed, not to mention almost every other resource under the Sun given the fact that their most agriculturally significant regions were under enemy occupation.
>>693230512
fuck off cuck faggot
>>693228308
Im not even gonna waste a bait meme on you
>>693229746
So hilariously off the mark in terms of comprehending the current situation, was your class called "Special" by any chance?
>>693229746
how did you put anyone in their place you said a line all war movies use
>>693230549
And the long german supply lines..the scorched earth policy that russians implemented during retreats robbing Germans of resources, the famine and diseases that Germans got..
>>693226416
holy shit this bait is great
>>693230853
This is the best you got? C'mon man, try harder.
>>693230919
so, luck? top kek its worse than i thought.
>>693230911
Because it's true?
>>693231035
It's cute that you think I'm trying.
>>693228044
God, this reminds me of a story my friend's neighbor told me.
His family fled Poland for Hungary when the Soviets came, he was very young. Then when the Soviets invaded Hungary, they took the men back with them as conscripts. His father and two uncles were marched off at gunpoint. He didn't mention them after that.
The day my friend bought his Mosin Nagant, his neighbor came over after we boiled the cosmoline out of it.
The look in his eyes as he held what could have been the rifle that herded his father off to his death was one of pure pain, yet he felt oddly whole, as if he finally had control over the memory.
He was much more approving of my Polish M44, and said he would trust it over the Russian one any day.
>>693225296
Japan should be much bigger than that. Look at the amount of island hopping the Allies had to do.
>>693231085
It wasn't really luck, the russians deliberately set for top their own slut as they retreated, and anybody that sits out in snow for months on end without food and clean water is going to suffer. They baited the germans..
>>693227324
But anon he already won
>>693231462
*set fire to their own shit* fucking autocorrect
What people don't get about the atom bombs and attacking civs in Japan is we firebombed the shit out of them before that.
"From January 1944 until August 1945, the U.S. dropped 157,000 tons of bombs on Japanese cities, according to the U.S. Strategic Bombing Survey. It estimated that 333,000 people were killed, including the 80,000 killed in the Aug. 6 Hiroshima atomic bomb attack and 40,000 in Nagasaki three days later. Other estimates are significantly higher. Fifteen million of the 72 million Japanese were left homeless."
>>693225296
>U.S. fought on 4 different fronts while at the same time single handedly beating the fuck out of japan
>lead the assault on D-day which was the turning point of the entire war, both the eastern and western front
>Lead the assault on italy, beat the living shit out of italy, pretty much singly handedly once again. (not much of an accomplishment but still)
>spent years sending metric shit tons of supplies, weapons, ammo and vehicles to the brits AND russians.
>protected euorpe and souteast asia from the USSR after the war was over
"HUR DUR ITS LIKE RUSSIA DID ALL THE WORK HUR DUR DUR HUR IM 14"
>>693229064
I've already beaten several of those animals off my property with a baseball bat. None speak Englisch or understand why we have law enforcement. Based cops around here don't give two fucks and have shot the sand niggers without any trouble for it.
>>693226522
>>693226625
you guys don't get that the two theaters were different fights. Russia fought for VE day, and we bombed our way thru to VJ day
>>693231124
doesn't mater you gave no argument you just regurgitated a line that doesn't mean you actually know what you are talking about its like a retard talking about shit they heard their dad say its meaningless unless they actually bring a point to the conversation.
>>693232052
Da sprechen natürlich leute Englisch, so ein scheiß
>>693232181
Actually I kinda do know what I'm talking about...
>>693232518
sure champ
>>693232065
Yeah. This is true.
>>693229125
When ONE bomb does that much destruction, it's a different story, compared to many bombs that do little.
>>693225296
Hey, fag, we defeated the brits and killed their empire in the sands of Suez.
>>693225790
You need to die, anti-nuke fag
>>693229671
this
>>693233336
>When ONE bomb does that much destruction, it's a different story, compared to many bombs that do little.
Fag, most of the damage was from the fire because their industrial cities were made of wood.
Hindsight, wow. what a thread.
>>693225296
IS THAT THE MEXICO'S FLAG AT THE RIGHT BOTTOM CORNER?!
>>693232052
>Based cops around here don't give two fucks and have shot the sand niggers without any trouble for it.
I love it.
I dont think the Nazi's were the greatest people in history. They did some shitty things. However, I do admire them for being prideful of their culture and their race. Something that Europe is so fucking ashamed about these days. ANY hint of nationalism is quashed.
In America, we have lots of Nationalism but we are not allowed to be proud of being white. I'm not talking about the "My race is better than you" pride, I'm saying we can't even say we exist.
So sad. Meanwhile blacks, asians and arabs can do and say whatever they want.
>>693233868
Yep.. USA actually helped them out with a free Urban renewal program.
"To be clear, this is not to suggest that in similar circumstances, a person who engaged in this activity would face no consequences. To the contrary, those individuals are often subject to security or administrative sanctions. But that is not what we are deciding now." - James B. Comey, FBI Director
This is criminal. He is saying that there is not equal treatment in this case.
twitter.com/HillaryClinton/status/688917116314120192?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
;
>>693233868
Still started from the same bomb.
>>693225790
Both cities were warned to evacuate before the bombs were dropped. Not dropping the bombs would have prolonged the war far year, and would have required an invasion and complete take over of the island. The Japanese were arming their people and made them aware that it would be fight to the very last man woman and child. In reality, those bombs saved Japan from total annihilation.
>>693234515
This.
>>693234051
>IS THAT THE MEXICO'S FLAG
Fuck, please dont be american
>>693226416
OBJECTIVLY WRONG
>>693234515
Ah yes, I'm sure what was clearly enemy propaganda was supposed to be taken seriously, right?
We as a people are so completely and utterly incapable of imagining a world before the atomic bomb that's it's useless to try. It's the single most significant point in human history.
>the USA and Britain teamed up with the commies
>brought killing civilian tactics to a new level
>plant the germans as the evil ones
>>693235043
I don't disagree at all. I'm just saying that proper warning was given. Whether or not it was taken seriously is of no fault of the US. But you're right. Humanity was given the capability to completely eradicate itself. Scary to think about, and people don't realize how close it has come to happening. More than once.
>>693235712
And I'm simply disagreeing with the "proper warning" qualifier; no one had any reason to believe such threats were serious or capable. Absolving the US of responsibility for that bombing in any capacity (especially when the reasons they chose Hiroshima were more scientific than anything else) is not very honest in my view.
>>693225296
pretty sure dinosaurs were not involved.
>>693236507
>I'm simply disagreeing with the "proper warning" qualifier; no one had any reason to believe such threats were serious or capable.
>be walking down street
>guy pulls knife on me
>I ask "Whadda gonna do? Stab me?"
>he says yes
>he stabs me
>mfw I didnt think he was serious
>>693237329
The only thing your analogy does is embarrass your logic. A more appropriate example would be if a guy pulled out a retro-style alien disintegration ray, or, you know, something so completely foreign and outside the realm of conceivability that it exists.
>>693234515
>those bombs saved Japan from total annihilation
Maybe your country needs saving, too?
>>693236507
There's no question of the US's responsibility for the bombing. I'm saying it's not the fault of the US that the Japanese government decided not to take it seriously and evacuate the city.
>>693225296
We had fucking dinosaurs in WW2? History is awesome!
>>693237760
Canada isn't a very tempting target. Maybe you should look further south...
>>693225790
>muh edgy anti USA
>dropping the bomb was wrong even though it prevented a land invasion which would of had millions more civilian and military casualties!
>>693237877
Sure it is, because the US then dropped an atomic bomb on another country. Literally the worst thing one country has ever done to another occurred after that warning. It is an inconceivable act of pure atrocity; if anyone's not to blame, it's the Japanese government.
>>693238121
But the majority of shitposters on 4chan is from Canada, so...
>>693237976
Don't be a fucking idiot, you can see from the pic that we WERE dinosaurs in WW2.
>>693238352
HOLY SHIT!
>Italians defeated
>Nazis defeated by teh Russian winter
>Japan on the brink of defeat
>muh port
>hey let's make the single double drop of nuclear weapons on civilians of a defeated country in the history of mankind
After Einstein warned Roosevelt of the nuke development by Germans and the US tech-rushed them and finished it after Hitler hero'd, does anyone really think the US would say "hey, we don't need them anymore, let's put them away"? kek
>>693238251
>Literally the worst thing one country has ever done to another
Killing approx 200,000 people is far from the worst thing one country has ever done to another. Clearly emotion trumps logic for you.
>>693238251
>literally the worst thing one country has ever done to another
I can't tell if you're trolling or retarded. Because Japan's invasion of China and its "Rape of Nanking" wasn't?
I don't disagree that it was an atrocity, and it unfortunately happened, but it was the lesser of two evils
See>>693234515 again
Did you just stop reading after the first line or something?
I miss owning slaves.
>>693238920
Uh, no, clearly metrics trumps logic for you. The detonation of two atomic devices against a foreign power, for what it means for the rest of mankind's entire existence, will forever be the worst thing one nation has done to another.
That is unless, all possible powers in existence forbidding it, that happens again.
>>693229671
Beautiful
Jokes aside, can someone from USA explain what's the point of Black History Month? Are blacks so different fropm other races that they need their special history month?
>>693239281
Keeps the natives from getting too restless if we let them pretend like they're worth a shit once in a while.
>>693239014
The kind of rationalization anyone uses to justify the "End to the War" argument of detonating atomic bombs over Japan requires massive amounts of assumption and no shortage of amoral thinking that the world after the atomic bomb is preferable to one that had the Japanese fighting MAYBE a little while longer.
Not sure why you linked that post like it's gospel fact.
>>693239228
It's good that it happened when it did. When nuclear technology was primitive and in its baby steps, rather when the world super powers had perfected their nuclear arsenals, it gave the world a chance to see the damage that it could cause with out actually being at its worst potential. And that right there stood the test of the tensions in the Cold War.
>>693229766
This, my school taught Russia made a big fucking contribution and the US came in to sweep out the rest of the Nazis.
>>693239281
The idea behind Black History Month is that black contribution to American history is systemically marginalized (not agreeing with this, just answering the anon's question) so by promoting a devotion to only or primarily black history during the month (February) there is at least a guarantee some time is dedicated to said contributions.
>>693239699
Because Millions of soldiers on both sides and millions of Japanese civilians would have perished. I think it's pretty justifiable. The estimated casualty count was one of the main deciding factors of whether or not to drop the bombs. You're acting like the US just dropped two atomic bombs all nilly willy. Months of planning and debating took place before the operation was even considered.
>>693239228
Nukes were going to be a thing regardless of a bomb being dropped or not. The U.S. using them or not using them would have made no difference. If anything the lasting impact of the million or so men we would have to have thrown into the grinder to take the Home Islands as well as the millions of Japanese soldiers/civilians killed to actually end the war.
You are clearly incredibly illogical and an insane romantic.
>>693239281
Think of it as one of many placebos in place so our current, lazy, FBI doesn't have to go full cointelpro
>>693239716
Detonation of atomic and nuclear devices on actual human beings was hardly necessary for the philosophy of mutually assured destruction to still take root during the Cold War. What you're implying is that theoretical calculation and actual atomic tests would not have been enough for this? That is a debatable point, but one I believe you are on the far weaker side for.
>>693240122
Nuclear technology was inevitable, I agree - detonating atomic or nuclear technology on human beings was not.
>>693240367
Bruh you're stawmanning the fuck out of this whole debate. You're completing avoiding anons main points by nitpicking with "theories" and "moral stand points".
>>693239699
There are written documents from the Japanese government that they were going to fight to last man, woman, and child. I will grant you that at some point the populace would capitulate, however I think you are severely underestimating the amount of life that would have cost.
By the time of surrender, the Japanese had 916,828 military personnel either in position or in various stages of deployment on Kyushu alone.[61] The total strength of the Japanese military in the Home Islands amounted to 4,335,500, of whom 2,372,700 were in the Army and 1,962,800 in the Navy
also
While the US had promised never to initiate gas warfare, Japan had used gas against the Chinese earlier in the war.[63]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Downfall
>>693240119
History has shown this was incorrect - the bombings were actually rushed due to Russia agreeing to join the US in the war against Japan; America wanted a stronger political position post-conflict before Russia had a larger contribution in the pacific theater and so rushed to end the war as quickly as possible.
>>693240771
Downfall? More like Operation LolGasTheChinks!
>>693229320
Welcome to 4chan, newfriend
>>693240664
You're using the term "strawman" incorrectly - I have not constructed anything to argue against, mainly I have pointed out (truthfully) that claims justifying the use of atomic weapons are speculative, because they are.
>>693225296
>FRANCE
>IZ A CHIKKUN
lololol
>>693240771
also this
In April 1945, the Joint Chiefs of Staff formally adopted a planning paper giving a range of possible casualties based on experience in both Europe and the Pacific. Given a troop list of 766,700 men and a 90-day campaign, the US Sixth Army could be expected to suffer between 514,072 casualties (including 134,556 dead and missing) under the "Pacific Experience" (1.95 dead and missing and 7.45 total casualties/1,000 men/day) and 149,046 casualties (including 28,981 dead and missing) under the "European Experience" (0.42 dead and missing and 2.16 total casualties/1,000 men/day).[78] This assessment included neither casualties suffered after the 90-day mark (US planners envisioned switching to the tactical defensive by D+120[79]), nor personnel losses at sea from Japanese air attacks.[80] In order to sustain the campaign on Kyushu, planners estimated a replacement stream of 100,000 men per month
>>693240897
Because they didn't want Russia to have a say in the aftermath of a theatre that that didn't take part in.
>>693226671
The reason was the oil embargo. For most of the 30's Japan was importing most of its oil from the US and UK (the US was a net exporter of oil back then, and the UK controlled a ton of oil fields in its colonies in the Middle East). But the US and UK agreed to cut off Japan's oil supply with an embargo after Japan invaded China in 1937. Japan obviously needed oil to run its military and sustain it's war with China, so their only choices were to either attack the United States and then capture the oil fields in Southeast Asia by force (which were controlled by various European colonies) or admit defeat and withdraw their forces from China. Obviously they didn't want to admit defeat to China, so they had to attack the United States.
>>693241119
So are reasons to have NOT used them if that's your argument.
>>693240771
Actually, a much more highly contested debate was that Japan was preparing to surrender prior to the bombings anyway - it's certainly not established fact either way, a little dishonest to represent it that way.
>>693241294
The U.S. embargoing Japanese slaughter of Chinese civilians seems like reasonable reaction. So, again, the Japanese brought it upon themselves.
>>693240771
>>693241159
and you took that info from US... see your mistake? You still believe the most lying country in the world...
>>693241357
Yes, obviously.
>>693226408
What evidence do you need that mass murder is wrong, Captain Edgelord McFuckwit?
>>693241119
And arguing against the use of them will also never hold ground. Because it never happened. The bombs fell. You have no proof that it was a mistake to drop the bombs, because the scenario where they didn't never happened. So you can only speculate.
>>693240897
True.
This is how we were taught it in the Air Force as of 2 years ago.
>>693241500
Never said they didn't. I've always supported the use of nuclear weapons on Japan. It ended the war quickly and thereby prevented potentially far greater devastation. I was merely putting their attack in historical context.
>>693225296
>Makes accurate WW2 image
>Doesn't mention Canada
>Mentions Poland
>>693241840
Actually, I have the benefit of knowing what a world in which two atomic bombs were detonated against another nation is like, because it's the one we live in today.
>>693226844
This is fucking hilarious
I dunno if it's been stated yet, but in a history documentary, it said Japan had been planning on releasing biochemical warfare on California (and would spread rapidly) in August before we bombed them.
>>693225790
Fuck civilians
>dat kill streak
Be jelly ya cuck fagget
>>693228670
kek
>>693225790
faggot, we didnt do shit
>>693241697
>killing is wrong
>even when you can save 5-10X more lives as you have to take
Liberal logic. Everything is evil, everyone is wrong who isnt me or doesn't agree with me. No exceptions, even those that are less wrong, thus more correct.
>add in "edgy insult" to sound hip
>>693242094
But you could never know whether or not the decision to not drop the bombs was in fact better. For all you know, it could be significantly worse, because the event would not be there to show the deviation and the emotional aspect of the whole thing. Had it been the other way around and Japan was invaded, you would be arguing for the bombs, because of the emotional and historic impact that the invasion would have had.
>>693225296
>France the chicken
>>693242466
Lesser known fact. The japs actually successfully landed bombs in Cali, they did not successfully detonate though.
>>693226072
Also it proved the US to be the new world power. Doing something like introducing and dropping an atomic bomb is basically saying "hey we're God now"
>>693225296
FALSE.
THERE WERE NO DINOSAURS
>>693242825
Oh wow. That's pretty cool to know. Reading this entire thread is actually really interesting, to be honest.
>>693227091
We deprived them of basic resources necessary for a growing nation that otherwise had no access to them, like oil and steel which was needed not only for their rapid population growth but their war with china. So yeah it obviously wasn't warranted but their intention was to catch the United States off guard because every competent Japanese military leader knew Japan lacked the industrial capacity to survive a long war with the United States. they wanted this to coincide with their seizure of pacific colonial territories and military bases and have a Pacific empire of sorts when the United States did get it's industrial engine going.
>>693242825
too bad
>>693242677
Nor have I argued that it would be - what I have done is point out the rampant speculation that the bombings were justified, which has included assumptions at best and blatant misinformation at worse. The only argument I have made, I also conceded was debateble when I made it here:
>>693240367
Which I stand by; The USSR and USA did not need to atrocities that were Hiroshima and Nagasaki to realize the terrible effects of atomic and later nuclear weaponry - their own testing would have revealed this on it's own.
>>693243027
go back to red dit
>>693225296
Top Kek.
>>693229629
THIS.
>>693227349
Thats their own fucking fault.
>>693241840
And keep in mind we don't yet know the ultimate consequences of dropping those two bombs. All we know is that post WWII, Japan has rebuilt within their assigned role and existed as an economic ally so far.
Howeever, Japan has in no way forgotten and put it behind them.
They're not going to lose their minds, break ranks, and launch an attack on the US out of nowhere, but when the shit hits the fan, and it's time for everyone to stab ceasar, Japan is going to be near the front of the line with all the technological retaliation they can bring.
...Japan is not wanting for technological warfare capabilities.
>>693242825
>>693243051
>>693243076
I take it back, at least one detonated and killed 6 people. Google Japanese fire bombs.
>>693242825
Even lesser known is that Japan actually DID invade American soil. Alaskan islands by the name of Kiska and Attu. Granted it was only a territory, but American nonetheless.
>>693227647
>>693227858
We did for most of WW2 as well. While FDR did everything he could to help the English, the American public was truly against getting involved with Europe or anyone for that matter.
Then Japan had to come around trying to swing it's dick around and we all know the rest.
Japan has pretty much existed guided by the United States, and a lot of it was for the Cold War. half of Japan is reluctant to even have a military presence at all when they reflect upon Imperial japan and its atrocities. But there is a resurgence of nationalism regarding the Constitution imposed on them
>>693242466
They actually did do that. Occassionally someone finds one. The biological payload was not a threat. The actual danger came from the dispersal detonator going off when some kid stumbles on it and tries monkeying with it.
They had no capabilities for an attack on the mainland US. It was already known by then.
>>693243246
Yes but the loss of life and destruction had the island been invaded would have been beyond comprehension. The dropping of the bombs put the fear and emotional impact of it all into every persons heart.
>>693244150
Simply apologist speculation, and again, was not the primary reason for dropping the bombs when we did - it was to ensure Russia had no real influence in the Pacific theater post-war.
>>693243808
>693243808
The killing of American citizens by German ships and bombs was increasing tensions. And we secretly bypassed our neutrality by giving aid to the English. So i doubt we wouldn't have eventually entered the conflict if it meant The Battle of Britain lasting even longer and Nazi domination of Europe seeming immanent.
>>693230491
Imagine how China felt. You sure as hell know they didn't put up that much of a fight. By their chunk of the pie, they were just fucked over a barrel by the Japanese. I guess they call it the Rape of Nanking for a reason.
>>693225296
Gotta love the way Americans reinvent history to make themselves look better. Nothing screams patriotism like a nuclear bomb annihilating thousands of innocent people. Stay classy amerifags.
>>693243808
dat ass
>>693244603
>innocent people
>>693244099
Yeah, they & der krautland allowed to hardly have a military at all for 2 generations time, to try to breed the old worlc culture out of their populations. Instead, we told them we's help them by supplying any military presence they'd need, and they could roll 100% of their tax revenue into more lucraticve technological & economic development for that time.
This had a few predictable side effects, and a few unpredictable ones.
itt; peopel from rapefugeeland jealous of freedoms.
>>693244312
The primary reason was to end the most devistating war in human history, no war has even come close to that level of death destruction before or since. Russian had no right to jump into a theatre of war at the last second anyway just to be able to have a say in what happens afterwards
>>693244603
i wish we dropped one on northern germany too.
>>693244847
That being said, in American casualties, the most fatal war was the Civil War, obviously.
>>693244773
Yup, innocent people. Just as innocent as the victims in 9/11 and the victims of Pearl Harbour. What the USA did in WW2 was a total act of terror and they shouldn't be applauded for at all.
>>693244603
> ad hominem with no real argument.
Yeah shitposting is pretty cool if you're 12 I guess.
>>693226271
Literally? Like at the very last minute?
>>693244956
Cool story edge lord. While we're at it, let's just nuke Mexico and Canada, because muh freedom and patriotism!
>>693244847
Don't know what else to tell you anon, that simply isn't true; the notion is was done to "end the war" is just romanticized revision of history. I don't know whether Russia had a right or not myself, but what I do know (and collectively 'we', from history) is that US didn't want them to have much of a say at all - this is why the bombs were dropped when they were, and possibly (possibly) why they were dropped at all.
>>693244773
>living in the same city
>GUILTY! TIME TO BURN TO DEATH EVERYONE YAYYYY!
>murrica is always a firce for good in the world!
>9/11: WUT? Indescriminately targeting our civilians cause you don't like our ideology? Thats terrorism! Lets bankrupt ourselves and shred our consitution and kill a million sandniggers for sport and make ourselves 1.2 billion new enemies!
>we r smart!
>>693244986
I'm not talking just American casualties, you jack knob. I'm talking on a global scale.
>>693234163
>be pride for others achivements
>do nothing
whew
>>693245181
Triggered you enough to comment, kiddo. Americans are so easy to bait.
>>693245201
>>693245201
Like 1917. Ended in 1918
Guys, this thread is fucking retarded
>>693245324
It may have been a reason to drop them, but it was by no means the only, nor the most important reason by a long shot.
>>693245420
> I don't understand what's being discussed.
RETARDS!
>>693244390
Sooner or later it was inevitable. Hitler planned to go all the way to South America and of course the US itself.
Just saying Pearl Harbor was the Catalyst that set off our involvement is all but more importantly that the Japanese were assholes. We had to completely break their back in order to create the docile nation you see today.
>>693245379
>ZOZZLE I EPIK TROLLED YOU GET REKT
Ftfy
>>693245270
No, because we need Mexicans to pick our fruits and vegetables and give us burritos, and we need Canadians for maple syrup for our pancakes.
They're imperial protectorates.
>>693245641
>being this butt hurt
So triggered.
>>693234163
Gay Pride Black Pride and White Pride are all fucking retarded. literally what did you do. At least faggots felt like they were showing their sexuality to a culture that disliked them when the first Gay Pride things happened. But at this point anyone who's proud of anything they literally did nothing to have is a fucking retard.
>>693245490
No, that is what I am saying, it was the primary reason, at the very least at that time, to drop them - this is a known fact of military and political strategy from history. The real argument is, if Russia would have had a greater presence in the Pacific theater, or if Japan would have surrendered before the bombs could be dropped later - but there is no question as to why they were dropped when they were.
>>693245559
It's the level of involvement of the United States throughout all of WWII, which was very little. From what I've gathered in my personal history research of WWII Britain did a shit load with incredible fighter pilots and infantrymen.
Still, this thread is fucking gay. No shit the US is going to teach its citizens mostly about it's own involvement; we are in a conceded country. Nothing new there.
Hence, fucking retarded thread
>>693245379
>edgy n dank anti American meem
>>693226271
Back when I was in school we were basically told the US didn't do fuckall in WW one except for profiteer off of arms deals.
>>693245940
Nope, not at all what was being discussed, but thanks for posting this as it proved my point.
>>693246053
I wouldn't know your point because I stopped reading after like the first 4 posts before I made mine. Still, this thread is fucking retarded.
>>693245343
USAland isn't particularly good at war.
It lucked out rolling in late to two world wars already winding diwn with spent enemies, fresh faced, fully stocked, and limitlessly fundred by england (& germany) having just sent it the entire amasssed wealth of their world-looting empires.
USA basically got handed two ready-made easy victories in the WW's, then got big ideas that it was invincible and proceeded to make a fucking bigger mess out of every country it strolled into before tucking tail, declaring victory, and going home, leaving a trail of insane radical unstable shitstorms in its wake that persist to this day.
>>693245623
They were and the military practically hijacked the goverment because they were swinging their dicks around following the Sino Japanese war and WW1. And even Leading Japanese officers and commanders knew that Pearl Harbor was a risky move and that once the US had it's industrial engine going japan lacked the capacity to compete and replace what was lost in a lengthy war. Literally everyone had to give in to the Militarists.
WWII infobyte Pearl Harbour is the only US State with 5 and 7 letters in its name that had a naval base
>>693225296
I am from fucking Papua new guinea and even I know USSR won the second world war.
>>693246295
My point was you didn't understand what was being discussed. You didn't think your little bullshit about the US's involvement contributed to anything, did you? Cute if you did.
>>693246478
faggot. It's Pearl Harbor. Named with the American spelling of Harbot, so it's 5 and 6 letters
>>693246478
Well done simon.
>>693246760
It puts da water car in da harbot
>>693245924
The USSR having any say in the pacific theatre would have caused even more tension in the Cold War than there already was, imagine splitting up Japan the way Germany had been. Yeah that would've been fun. Regardless, the bombs ended the war immediately, no further conflict was necessary against Japan. The nations will to fight had crumbled, without annihilating the population. Russia has been kept out of the pacific theatre, and the United States as well as all soon to be (and a little longer to be) nuclear powers witnessed the devistating effect of atomic weapons on real, living, feeling humans. That impact in itself showed that the atomic bombs should never be used again.
>>693226625
Russia had shit lot of troops.
The eastern front was all about attrition. Hence they pushed when things turned their way in the winter of 41.
No other country would of really survived the mass losses suffered in the eastern front.
>>693246760
>pearl harbor
>a state
Wew lad
Reason we dropped the bombs on Japan, when we did, was threefold:
1) To allow the Japanese emperor and people to "Save Face" in accepting surrender to an obviously superior power,
2) To bluff Russia into stopping its advance and acknowledging said surrender,
and 3) bluffing the American people into thinking "It Was All Worth It, (And now we're invulnerable. Re-elect our asses,)"
Also, because 4) Things That Go BOOM are Cool, says Oppenheimer.
>>693246478
mfw pear harbor is a state
>and yes it harbor not harbour
>>693247426
I wasn't speaking to that part of the statement. I was only speaking to the eurofag spelling of the word harbor
>>693247474
It was a state after the chinks bombed it
>>693247622
>burger
>only selecting words they like
>right to bare arms means guns and not tank tops
Muh freedoms
>>693246549
If that werent impressive enough, even after getting fed into the meatgrinder in the war, Stalin still figured he hadn't wiped out enough russians, and made a national pastime out if it. AND YET, they still had enough in the tank that they managed to, without financial assistance like europe & Japan got, make a fuckton of physics, energy, mathematical & scienctific discoveries in a million fields, build a fucking space program, a nuke program, beat the US every step of the way in the soace race for 20 years, and just in general survive at all for another 50 fuckin years since the war with a US at its peak trying to destroy them politically and economically and socially and sometimes militarily.
I mean jesus, no other country on earth did so much, not to mention with so little.
>>693247184
Sure, but again this is all speculation - your argument would be rendered moot if Japan had surrendered when it was rumored to anyway (around when we dropped the bombs) which would have stopped the Soviets from having any influence anyway.
What your speculation does not support, however, is that the detonation of these bombs were necessary for the mutual destruction philosophy of the Cold War - I contend it was not, that the affects of atomic and nuclear weaponry would have been well known to both superpowers without Hiroshima and Nagasaki. You can continue to argue it was necessary, but there's just no good reasoning to support that position.
>>693247826
you sir, are retarded.
>Harbor
>Harbour
same word, different spelling. It's supposed to be used with respect to the subject at hand. I wouldn't give a fuck if you said colour because it's an objective concept. However, something NAMED in a country that uses a specific dialect holds the spelling.
Example: Americans don't go around spelling 'Luxembourg' as 'Luxemborg' or 'Luxenburg' because we understand the geographical significance of the spelling.
>>693248503
Sorry, I'm drunk tonight. I mean't 'Luxemburg' at the second quotation
>>693248002
I remember having to learn Russian in the 7th grade because our entire area was all recently settled by germans post-war, we they wanted us to be able to communicate with russian soldiers effectively should they invade. It was a very real concern at that time. I sort of miss a formidable Russia. One superpower with absolute power running amok in the world unopposed hasn't been good for the world or for the US, corrupting itself absolutely to new heights daily.
>>693225790
>>693226072
>>693227466
everyone dies in war, you fags act like even before modern history civilians didnt die in times of war, and that atrocities didnt happen
find something else to argue about
>>693225296
This is so fucking stupid, OP. There were no dinosaurs in WWII
>>693248503
>>693248623
>I'm drunk
Well that explains why you sound so retarded. You took some mad bait straight to your ugly face.
>>693248623
"I'm drunk" is the most often repeated cringy lie on the internet for when anyone makes a mistake.
>>693248153
It was never rumored to surrender. The Emperor made it well known to everyone including the US that it would be a fight to the finish. This weapon allowed the Japanese people to wake up a realize the amount of devistation they were facing. Before it was about honor and protecting their culture and homeland. After the bombs fell, it was the slap back into reality showing that if the war continues, all of Japan will burn. They had already lost, but we're so caught up with their "death before dishonor" philosophy, that they didn't see doom staring their entire country in the face.
>>693248669
Not since the bronze age when "sacking" civilizations was a thing.
>>693248843
The Emperor was originally anti war with the United States but got strong armed by his militarist government. As were a lot of leading Japanese commanders. The death before dishonor thing was overshadowed by logic plenty of times if you actually read into it.
Lusitania = Murica send ship into german waters and it sinks, joins wwi
Pearl Harbor = australians inform mericans the japs are coming, muricans say no we need this so we can attack japland
Gulf on Tonkin
Shit boys some gooks attacked our boat we sent into their waters, beter land troops in vietnam
911
Fuck it its worked the last few times and they are to stupid to even question it just fly some fucking planes into shit and blame the sand niggers, invades iraq because someone said they saw a sand nigger there once
CANTWAKEUP.mp3
>>693226408
>mfw 'murica nuked the gooks to "win"
>Shoot each other in the streets like the degenerate nation of filth they are.
You're all such humanitarians right...
>>693248687
Prove it.
All the dino bones I've ever seen in my lifetime were in the ground. For all we know they could have died fighting in the war as OP's photo clearly shows. I suppose youre going to tell me you've seen dinos existing somewhere.
>>693248843
This is simply not true - not from historical study, nor from a logical point of view. If the Hirohito and/or the Japanese people were truly resolved in "fighting to the last man", the atomic bombs wouldn't have changed that - that fact that they did surrender completely contradicts your speculation. That said, it has been hotly debated, but yes, it is an ongoing debate that Japan was close to a surrender before Hiroshima.
>>693225296
What is lend lease.
>>693248796
I only get on here when I'm drunk nowadays and it's usually about this time because my kid is sleeping
>>693248814
There isn't anything cringe worthy about drinking. And I've been making them all night because I actually am drunk. On my 3rd glass of bourbon. The only reason I made my correction is because I accidentally typed 'harbot' earlier instead of 'harbor'
>>693249349
What the fuck are you doing, anon? It's all about KDR you fucking noob, who cares that the US supplied everyone, Russia especially, the transportation and resources needed to fight the war?
>>693249446
Shit, forgot to add that I did it because >>693247079
made fun of me, which actually got me to laugh
>>693229671
I...I think I love you anon
>>693249446
Is your kids name Harbot?
>>693249122
Yeah and even when the Emperor DID call for surrender, there were plans of a coup to over throw him and continue the war.
>the death before dishonor thing was overshadowed by logic plenty of times
Same goes for the opposite.
>>693248900
I'm sorry, hold on a sec... Are you suggesting, seriously, that war is somehow an ordered exercise where everything goes to plan and innocents are (or can be) kept out of the line of fire, and no one used scorched earth policy or sacking and rapine slaughter since the Bronze Age? Not intentionally strawmanning you if that's not what you mean; just calling for clarification.
>>693249197
I'm calling false flag on your bait.
>>693249649
nope
>>693249274
It's like you don't read all of the post. Or you're too stupid to comprehend how a weapon that is unimaginably powerful and has never been seen before could shake a populous into favoring a call for surrender.
>>693249274
They'd already agreed to the terms for surrender once. Then the US said fuck thaose terms, here, enjoy these nukes, now we have new terms for you to agree to.
That was 2 totally unecessary indescriminate attacks on densely populated civilian targets, with weapons well-tested designed specifically to maximize casualties.
No bullshit, Japan owes us a couple nuked cities for that, I'll give em that.
Ok, we'll give ya the furst two cities as freebies, Japan. But then we're even, and you hit us after that and it's on again.
>>693250079
>Eye for an eye makes the whole world blind
>>693249716
No, I don't think it does - with all the rampant speculation you've been doing, suddenly a coup that overthrows the Emperor of Japan leads to a smooth transition that continues a war against the US and Russia like nothing happened? And the highly regimented Japanese military and people just accept it?
>>693249798
I wish it were bait and yes every time murica went to war it was because of a false flag operation
>>693250064
> I don't like that you pointed out a logical contradiction in my speculation, you're stupid.
How pathetic, anon.
>>693249758
Is that what I said? No, I didn't, I said indescriminate mass murder of non-combatants and razing their civilization to rubble hasn't geen how warfare has worked since "sacking" was an accepted practice, which was all the way back in the bronze age.
If I'd meant that other vague/generalization/straw man bullshit you just siad, I'd have written that instead.
>>693250079
[citation needed]
