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Where my Commies at
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Where my Commies at
>>
Bernie Sanders go home.
>>
Take your safe rebellion back to cuckbook desu
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>>/leftypol/
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>>683656811
>Bernie Sanders
>socialist
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ITT: we aren't here to "fix" capitalism. We're here to destroy it.
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>>683656811
>>683656962
You never seen the real left before, kiddies.
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>>683657833
>>683658108
Marxism-lenninism is dead. Long ive anarcho-communism
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>>683658563
I don't argue over tendencies when it comes to the need for political action. There's one thing we can all agree on - the private ownership of capital must be abolished in order to liberate the people of the world. The economic kings must go the way of the political kings.
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>>683656700
>ITT bay area petit bourgeoisie faggots LARPing as the disaffected proletariat

How does it feel knowing that the actual working class hates you commie niggers?
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>>683658882
Muh comrade
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>>683657833

Pathetic faggots.

Communism is practically mainstream now.

Not trendy unique or cool. Just part of the problem and without a clue.
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>>683659212
The gravediggers return, comrade. It is only a matter of time.
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>>683658563
But Marxism-Leninism is the only variant of Communism to ever produce a modicum of positive results. Maybe because it's the fashiest.
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Looks like the Freikorps missed a few.
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>>683659092
>LARPing as the disaffected proletariat
/the-end
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>>683659092
B-but muh college denbts
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>>683659092
>>683659297
>an ineffective bourgeois liberal made me mad once
>gosh I hate communism

Your critiques might be more effective if you, you know, learned what socialism was about first.
>>
A simpler guide for the mystified
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>>683657694
Thread
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>>683656700

Hey, remember that time Communism worked and the leader of the communist nation didnt turn into a despot who ruled with an iron fist and totally didnt murder and jail dissenters?

Me neither
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>>683659707
>educate yourself, shitlord~!

I've read the communist manifesto. Thought it was pretty gay tbh

also,
>posting mandela as an example of a good communist

fucking kek
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>>683656700
best america when
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>>683659707
>says the bourgeois college liberal
The working class is nationalist these days. People still remember what a failure communism was.

>>683660131
>muh real communism
Trotskyites go
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>>683660181
Cool argument pal. I've literally never heard that one before in my life.
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>>683660181
>Communism
>Leader
Please don't imply the USSR was acheived communism
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>>683656700
This is funny because the working class is who really loses with communism/socialism/anything that takes from the earners and gives to the lazy. We are more than capable of taking care of ourselves individually. I want no part of your social "utopia".
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>>683660384
And I've literally never heard you faggots say anything in response to it except for,

>b-b-but it wasn't REAL gommunism!

Marx called for a despotic socialist state that he thought would eventually dissolve into a magical happy land where there was so money, class or state. It's fucking delusional and based on nothing but 'muh feels'.
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>>683660687
Refer to the second part of >>683660297
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>>683660687
They're unable to tell the difference because that would require questioning American propaganda.
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>>683660384

And yet you cant give me one example...hm
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>>683660868
>so
meant no
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>>683660181
Remember when a capitalist state ended up providing all the needs of the people, and there was no poverty or exploitation.

Me neither, Cunt.
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>>683660687

>No true scotsman.
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>>683656700
>working class
>never had a job
this delusion
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Rev up those ovens.
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>>683656700
Spanish-fag here, thanking the international brigades from 36 to 38. First step, even before the WW2
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>>683660269
As a Georgian speaking for Georgians everywhere. We refuse your faggot ass Georgia flag and commie ideals.
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>>683660902
>live in 18th century
>give me one example of successful powered flight
>all I see are people jumping off of buildings and flapping their arms
>therefore powered flight is impossible
>QED
>>
I'm not letting a bunch of douchebags who think they got it ALL figured out tell me how to live my life.
Fuck you, I'll keep my freedom.
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>>683661189

>Remember when a capitalist state ended up providing all the needs of the people, and there was no poverty or exploitation.

You misspelled communism
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Someone need a ride?
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>>683660868
>>683660297
There are more communist theorists than marx and trotsky
>>
Thats cute,
27,000 Americans commit suicide.
5,000 attempt suicide; some estimates are higher.
26,000 die from fatal accidents in the home.
23,000 are murdered.
85,000 are wounded by firearms.
38,000 of these die, including 2,600 children.
13,000,000 are victims of crimes including assault, rape, armed robbery, burglary, larceny, and arson.
135,000 children take guns to school.
5,500,000 people are arrested for all offenses (not including traffic violations).
125,000 die prematurely of alcohol abuse.
473,000 die prematurely from tobacco-related illnesses; 53,000 of these are nonsmokers.
6,500,000 use heroin, crack, speed, PCP, cocaine or some other hard drug on a regular basis.
5,000+ die from illicit drug use. Thousands suffer serious debilitations.
1,000+ die from sniffing household substances found under the kitchen sink. About 20 percent of all eighth-graders have “huffed” toxic substances. Thousands suffer permanent neurological damage.
31,450,000 use marijuana; 3,000,000 of whom are heavy usuers.
37,000,000, or one out of every six Americans, regularly use emotion controlling medical drugs. The users are mostly women. The pushers are doctors; the suppliers are pharmaceutical companies; the profits are stupendous.
2,000,000 nonhospitalized persons are given powerful mind-control drugs, sometimes described as “chemical straitjackets.”
5,000 die from psychoactive drug treatments.
200,000 are subjected to electric shock treatments that are injurious to the brain and nervous system.
600 to 1,000 are lobotomized, mostly women.
25,000,000, or one out of every 10 Americans, seek help from psychiatric, psychotherapeutic, or medical sources for mental and emotional problems, at a cost of over $4 billion annually.
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>>683661490
That's literally what you're doing by defending capitalism, retard.
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>>683661450

Communism had nearly a century and hundreds of millions of people behind it. What exactly did they accomplish besides criminalizing dissent and creating oligarchies?

at least with capitalism you know the leaders are fucking scum bags but they dont fucking own you.
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>>683661642
Yes, but typically the oven fuel that complain about tankies and muh true communist state are Trotskyites

>>683661450
So you're admitting that communism is only possible if ever in a post-scarcity society?
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Comrades, it seems that one of our main ideological objectives should be to teach the uneducated precariat the difference between bourgeois liberals and socialists.
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>>683661642
Then give me an argument that isn't just

>muh real communism has never been tried
>no I'm not scottish why are you asking
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>>683661691
Then if capitalism proves to infringe upon my freedoms, I'll be pissed off.
However private enterprise is the only way to make sure that there isn't a single entity that will ALWAYS have an agenda (government) doesn't take over. Instead, multiple entities are kept in check but allowed to grow and thrive and because of competition will constantly seek to out do each other and thus provide better and better "stuff".
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>>683656700

It's 2016, m8. Your 'working class' work at McDonald's.
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>>683661319
>Anarchism can't work because without laws everyone will be meanies. MUH free-will. The man is a wolf to man.
Pick up a book
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>>683656700

>underageb&
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>>683662269
>private enterprise is the only way to make sure that there isn't a single entity that will ALWAYS have an agenda (government) doesn't take over.

It ensures that a single entity - the ruling class - with an agenda - the perpetuation of their economic privilege - will take over. This inevitability is why you have to go through the charade of pretending that government corruption is created within the political system by evil liberal elites of some form (because the suggestion that it's the economically-powerful pulling all the strings behind the scenes contradicts your worldview).

What you think is "socialism" or "communism" is nothing but state capitalism. And there were good historical reasons why the Russian Revolution failed in this way, but that's another conversation.
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>>683662596
In an anarchist society, how do you stop people from forming governments and taking things by force?
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>>683656700
Right here we'll take over in 2024 Comrade.
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>>683662904
I don't know - ask the libertarians. They claim to have it figured out. Or they're trying to bring about neo-feudalism; I'm never quite sure which.
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>>683659092
this tbh
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>>683660188
>I've read the communist manifesto
Anything else that goes into Leftist thought? Das Kapital, Conquest of Bread, The Ego and Its Own? No? That explains it, then.
Read a book, nigger.
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>>683663097
Libertarians believe in constitutional rights and being left the fuck alone. Anyone should be able to do whatever they want as long as it doesn't infringe on anyone's rights or damage anyone's property. This would be best I think
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>>683661319
>freedom means having the ability to gain unequal social-political-economic power
>and then use it to oppress others
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>>683663503
So your answer is 'Murica? Oh good, you've clearly got it all figured out.
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>>683660131

Okay so what falls under this "common ownership?" I am genuinely intrigued. I just hate the vagueness.
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>>683663530
Power grows out of the barrel of a gun, nigger.
Mao said that, you like him.
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>>683662899
I'm not denying that capitalism (especially here, in America) can run rampant, but socialism and communism is basically the same thing only worse: not only do you have one entity with an agenda in charge of everything, but they are, I guarantee you, corrupt.
And system that allows for almost to full control over the economy by the government can and will, WILL be taken advantage of. Because it's run by people, and people are douchebags.
A person is smart, people are an unthinking herd that is easily influenced.
Both communism and socialism rely solely on faith in humanity, which is the dumbest move you can make.
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I hope all you red scum get hanged for your unnatural and naive views.
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>>683663530
Oppression doesn't exist. Everyone individually has the ability to do whatever they want unless they're disabled. Your personal bad or good choices are why you're where you're at today. Don't like it? Make better choices. Or ya know, vote for the govt to take from the earners and give to you
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>>683656700
Leeching off of the taxpayers and being unproductive.
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>>683663097
Yeah libertarians are pretty shit-tier tbh fam

Fascism is literally the only way to go
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Fuck Off Please.
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>>683656700
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>>683663732
No. My answer is leave me the fuck alone. I made mine. Go make yours. Just don't expect me to pay for it
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>>683662904
An anarchist society does not mean that there are no regroupments of people taking decisions together. It means that there are no representative mandates, driect democracy is mandatory. And if a group tries to build an army to break direct democracy then it will get war. You can also prevent groups of citizens from rebellion with good education and propaganda.
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>>683661223
This. Every single political major and wannabe socialist I've ever met has gone straight from their parents house, to college, to univercity then back to their parents house.

While the real working class went from school to work, to a flat/appartment to a morgage.

I love the fact that when Trump gets in to power he won't erase their hilarious student debt or give them anything for free.
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>>683664006
Fascism is best of the best, but libertarians and ancaps usually come around to our way of thinking anyway. No point in attacking them,
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>>683664298
What if the direct democracy votes in a more authoritarian government?
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>>683663873
If you want to have an intelligent conversation about this, then you really have to start understanding socialism from some perspective besides cold war American dogma. Socialists don't want to recreate the Stalinist USSR.
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>>683663848
Not even a commie but this is just autistic
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>>683664496
I've never heard any form of socialism explained in a way that didn't immediately sound repugnant and enabling of degeneracy, but you're welcome to try.
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>>683664478
Am libertarianish. Can confirm. I just wanna be left the fuck alone
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>>683664494
Well the principle of direct democracy is that there is no government and that decisions are made by the people, but if the people voted for the end of direct democracy well it would happen and the ones against it would probably leave or it would start a war.
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>>683661691

Here's the bottom line you jealous little faggot, Socialism/Communism didn't make my family rich. Competition and a free market did. Some backwoods redneck ranchers that barely finished high school now own some of the biggest dealerships in our state/neighboring states and they did it in a generation. WTF would I want to hear your bullshit about equality and who owns property for?

Anyone, a fucking woman, a nigger, a shitload of asian and indian immigrants (who dominate private business ownership where I live) even your sad, lame, poor family of failures could have gotten a small loan and started selling pickup trucks. BUT YOU DIDN'T. So fuck you. Tough shit. You aren't going to get whats ours. Work harder, pussy.
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>>683664653
Probably because it's hard to listen and understand other people when you're repeatedly screaming "muh human nature" at the top of your lungs.
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>>683664940
>being this much of a kulak
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>>683664942
That's not fair. That dude gave you a solid argument in a low tone without being a dick and you just lost any credibility for your argument by being an ass.
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>>683665252

have fun crying about being poor. SMITE ME SMITE ME!!!! you will never achieve your pathetic little goals of a leftist government. i will always be rich. get pissed nigger.
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>>683664942
I've also never heard a commie explain why human nature doesn't real
Self-interest and in-groups have been the watchwords since Sumer and no one has been able to change it.
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>>683656700
In hell.
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>>683664478
They're fucking terrible at arguing with commies though. Typically they just sperg out about muh free markets and leave themselves wide open to the whole "Le communism has never been tried!" nonsense.

I will agree that I prefer them to most other political groups, but still.

>>683664911
>muh anarchism will totally work and won't just lead to petty warlords taking things by force because direct democracy
later;
>if the people vote to be ruled I guess it will just happen
kek
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Better dead than Red.
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>>683665322
>Tell me of a communism that is not shit
>Solid argument
Are you for real
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>>683665322
That wasn't an argument; that was a deliberate misrepresentation of the aims and ideas of socialism, which are the only terms on which angry white American reactionary kiddies will have this conversation.
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No.
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>>683665605
I'm just saying he responded with a logical argument deserving of the same in return and you figuratively said "ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!?" You are not to be taken seriously from this point forward. Btw I'm the guy that just wants to be left the fuck alone
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>>683665669
>angry white American reactionary kiddies

are you the autistic marxist from the "why do we hate reddit" thread who had a spectrum fit over the course of like 30 posts last night? Or do you just all sound the same?
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>>683664496
I'll admit that socialism is significantly more tame than communism, but it's still one of those things that's only good on paper.
Plus, the idea of equal distribution and "everyone gets a share no matter what" does not take into account that not everyone necessarily deserves those goods.
And since the idea of deserve/doesn't deserve is so subjective, you can't really regulate that shit without invasion of privacy or literally monitoring what everyone's doing so that their actions meet some sort of standard, which infringes upon your personal freedoms.
Now, in order to avoid wasting time, money, and resources the government has to step in and go all gestapo on your ass.
Whereas with capitalism, which mind you is still pretty much ruled by the lower class since that's where the rich guys (BTW just because someone's rich doesn't automatically mean they are just some asshole who got that money through cheating the system, and who are you to say how much money I can have, why are you so concerned over an essentially useless item that only has value because we assign it?) Have to compete with other rich guys and create better "stuff".
Now, obviously there just some things that shouldn't be privatized, but that's an entirely different discussion.
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>>683665950
>I'm the guy that just wants to be left the fuck alone
>I want to be left alone
>but enjoy the comforts of living in a society based on communal labor
>>
I think the best kind of state would be a capitalist one with the government funding a private company and earning profit from it, they would then use the money earned to benefit the people (free healthcare etc). Additionally, the government would loan money to small companies at a low rate and earn money from interest, then use that interest to invest in more small companies; this way inflation is slowed down due to competing companies, which would result in less extremely wealthy individuals that have so much money that they can't spend it all (causes inflation).
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>>683665579
There are no contradictions here. Chosing to submit yourself to a leader or a group is diffrent from being attacked and enslaved by a group.
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>>683665669
Anon are you implying you aren't an angry white (or (((white))) I guess) American college student
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>>683665605
Communism was meant to have three key points
1) A natural, not forced, progression from late stage Capitalism, therefor it was needed to have a party to force it through.

2) International brotherhood, when each and every regime immediately began killing their competition in every single country it has been enacted in.

3) Means of ownership transfered to the working class, in nearly each case the means of production goes directly to those in the party, the polical elite. Again, in every case the ruling party elite (Not the party, the people) end up taking the means of production.

Communism is the result of a weak mind and failed upbringing, those who profess to want it should take a leaf from the refugees plight and fuck off to one of the backwards, bread-line countries.
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>>683665950
>I've never heard any form of socialism explained in a way that didn't immediately sound repugnant and enabling of degeneracy,but you're welcome to try.

This is not an arguement. It is a statement
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Fucking communist plebs, I'm getting real tired of your shit.
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>>683666174
Sure, but you fail to understand that a people will almost always prefer to be ruled in dire times. It's basic psychology really.

Unless you have a post-scarcity society populated entirely by philosopher NEETs there's literally no way anarchism would last.
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>>683666104
My society is based on me working hard for what I have. Not working hard to pay for a bunch of lazy faggots that have never and don't want to ever work a day in their lives. The people I work with are a team, sure. But if the weak link fails we don't work together to raise them up, we fire their ass and leave them to die and put someone in their place with the foreshadowing of "don't fuck this up kid. You won't get a second chance." This is the best way. And at the end of the day I have taken care of me and still wish to be left the fuck alone
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>>683666057
>I'll admit that socialism is significantly more tame than communism

This tells me that you don't understand socialism at all, which is why you continually attempt to argue against a point that nobody is trying to make. A discussion about socialism is not a conversation about "statism" versus individual rights. The goal of socialism is not to transfer ownership of all property from private individuals to a state bureaucracy. If you're just creating capitalism where the state does everything, we call that state capitalism.

Until you're willing to acknowledge the positions that other people are actually taking, there is no purpose in attempting to debate socialism with you.
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>>683666495
It was a direct request for rhetoric. He gave an opportunity to give the convincing speech of all speeches. But as usual it's just met with "are you kidding me?"
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>>683666624
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>>683656700
The Ypg is a potential com. System.
Small group
Idiology is based on marxism and apoism
No hatred against religions
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>>683666624
I'm the guy arguing for capitalism
>>683666057
And I think you have a pretty fucked view of things.
It's a much wiser investment to help someone if they're falling behind. If they're not reciprocating that help to improve themselves, then yeah drop them.
Capitalism doesn't mean being an asshole.
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You grubby Khazarian Commie cult Jew bastards will lose. Back to the gulags with you!
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>>683666944
I am ok with this. Fuckers can't swim they shouldn't get in the god damn pool. We also make great industry professionals.
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>>683667028
>Capitalism doesn't mean being an asshole.

says the guy who has clearly never been on the receiving end.
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I'm happy to see that feminists and SJW's are joining your cause. We a new face of communism to exploit in the means of instilling fear throughout our corporate mass media outlets. Thus creating a strong right wing base.
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>>683666589
Thats where you're wrong. People will not always want to be ruled in dire times. While losing the war against the prussians. A buch of French got sick of their retard warmongering government and formed Paris commune wich was not destroyed because people wanted a leader but because the rest of France attacked them. Even if it was a dire time a lot of people still wanted no leader. The humaun nature is maleable due to our ability to learn desires and behaviors. Do not think every human beings react the same way to dire situations.
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>>683666814
Then explain it to me.
Explain to me how you're super-specific form of socialism will work this time.
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>>683667028
Oh. Right on then.
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>>683656700
I am sympathetic to your plight, but I disagree with your solution.
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>>683667265
>I'm happy to see that feminists and SJW's are joining your cause.

You're all just capitalists to me
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>>683667258
Receiving end?
I've been working a city job for the past four years cleaning up other people's shit.
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>>683667258
If someone was an asshole to you you were probably spouting commie bullshit to someone who actually worked a day in his life and doesn't have time to pay for your lesbian dance therapy degree.
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>>683667015
Exactly the same way as Socialism, wealth redistribution. Take the labor of one and give it to another, you sank your own argument you fucktard. This is a screaming endorsement for Capitalism and the free market.

>>683667104
Minimum wage, prevention of child labor and all modern labor benifits came out of the Capitalist system, not the labor union movement as people are want to believe.

>>683667265
The more people like this push, the stronger the nationalist sentiment will grow, America will never be anything other than Capitalist, the world needs it to keep pushing technological advancement and generate the funds to supply the rest of the world. So they can import food when theirs goods die in the field, so they can import medicine for their leaders when the medical leaders flee. By default, America is needed to keep failed Capitalist nations in power because they have a wealthy nation to bankroll them indirectly.
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>>683667366
Socialism is only succesful in small groups
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strange how it always ends in starvation, mass killings and despair.
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>>683667521
Well, even if they are capitalists, it doesn't take much to paint them as communists when they claim to be one. And so long as terrible people wear your label, it's more than enough to strengthen our base in your opposition.
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>>683656700
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>>683667753
I'm the guy arguing for capitalism, but I'm pretty sure that was Stalin and not Lenin.
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>Left wing gorvernment attending to the needs of the many while doing a rather lousy job in terms of administration
>Right wind hates them with all their might for all the wrong reasons
>"stop feeding the poor and teach them how to fish while they starve, it works everywhere!"
>economic crisis hits hard thanks to very poor administration + tons of pressure of the right wing + all the corruption you can imagine on both sides
>calls for impeachment since day 1 when they didn't even had a reason why
>Right wing gains lots of terrain thanks to huge corruption scandals
>media (which always supports right wing, no matter what) focus mostly on the left wing, even though every right wing leader is being accused but magically unharmed thanks to technicalities
>the wholle thing gets more and more retarded, you can count with you fingers the number of politicians not accused of corruption
>Right wing militants go full "comunist conspiracy to undermine ecnomy" mode
>Suddenly people are actually calling you a comunist motherfucker for wearing red in public
>Deputies prove once and for all that they are either the most illiterate people on politics or just plain stupid
>right wing extremist who compliments torturers getting more and more support
>Some people think the opposite of comunism is facism
>Other people argue that Hitler was a left wing comunist
>People think they are fixing corruption but can't explain how
>MFW this so retard i can't even find an appropriated reaction pic
>MFW i'm mostly ok with captalism and people keep calling me socilist pig even though they are more dependant on services controled by the government than i (they even argue that the state should have more control over said stuff, it's fucking nuts)
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>>683667625
What do you work for ? Humans are not made to work in a office you shit. Wake up it's a slavery system look at those one who keep 99% oft the money for Them self
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>>683667862
>when they don't understand the difference between private property and personal possessions
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>>683666624
Amusingly enough the selective pressures of a strictly capitalist society would probably be incredibly good for genetic fitness over the course of a few generations too. When everyone is taken care of, eugenics becomes necessary to avoid an africa-tier situation.
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>>683667692
I'm just happy that tumblr exists, they're the right-wings gift that gives something new to report and be afraid of, even though they're really nothing to be afraid of. I think we need to attack college millennials next.
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>>683668323
Like you would have any in a communist society
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>>683668266
So regulate them in a state-capitalist system. Or form unions. None of this justifies going full autistic communist.

Also, only a very small percentage of jobs are office jobs. Confirmed for petit bourgeoisie faggot who has never left his metropolitan center.
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>>683668886
>full autistic communist

None of you have the slightest clue what you're talking about.

"Stateless, classless society whose goal is universal emancipation is obviously about absolute authoritarianism and slavery. Why would the capitalists lie to us about anti-capitalism?"
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>>683668266
I work for money so I can buy things I need and want.
>humans weren't made to

Grow the fuck up. I worked hard to get where I am and I'm not about to sit here and be reprimanded for that. If you're able bodied and don't have the will to earn what you want then you don't deserve what I have. It has been this way since the dawn of man. You want shelter? Build it faggot. You want food? Kill it pussy. But don't expect to sit at my fucking table and gorge your fat ass without having provided something to the meal.
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>>683661397
But, that flag is 2/3 french, what's not to like?
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>>683668266
Also boohoo the rich got rich. They earned it. Get over it pussy
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>>683668266
You could argue that humans were never made to travel space, and yet, here we are achieving our goals. Why don't you go live on an island somewhere by yourself where you can have all the anarchy you want? It'll be just like the movie castaway, except you can think of it as paradise.
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>>683669252
I know what communism is you fucking faggot. Not everybody who argues against you thinks that communism=Stalinist USSR
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>>683669427
You sound like someone who would have fun reading Starship Troopers, have you?
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>>683669264
>You want food? Kill it pussy
>b-but don't kill us and take our stuff pls
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>>683669546
If you did understand, you'd know that you can't "go communist". Sounds like you've got the standard American ten measures of confidence, half-measure of knowledge.
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>>683657694
Almost everything in that picture is the opposite of the truth.
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>>683669604
I didn't say that. And you'd have a hard time trying to kill me or mine. You're welcome to try though.
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>>683669304
We're very sensitive about our flag in GA. Lol.
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>>683670026
>starving mobs break into your gated community and murder you
>t-thats not what I meant
>save me Mr. Galt
>>
Funny how Communist faggots always talk about the working class, yet they always live off of the gov dime or mommy and daddy. People who actually work are laughing at you fucking idiots.

PS, countries that once were ruled by Communism never want it back. Your ideology fails.

Sincerely, a working class man.
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>>683669767
I've probably read more of your ideology's literature than you have. Stop hiding behind pseudo-intellectual cryptic bullshit intended to inflate your own pitiful knowledge base and argue like a man.
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>>683667111
>Everything you need to know
Tell me about the other stuff "I don't need to know"
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>>683670457
So your answer is yes?
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>>683670447
>>683659092
yep

pic related, average 'working class' communist
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>>683669591
That's kind of a stretched assumption based on what I said, but not really. Never read it, but I thought the movie was okay at best. It passed the time. I'm sure the book was better.
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>>683670425
So that's what communism is all about? Helping criminals be criminals? Because if you're starving there are things you could get. Gosh what are those pesky things... Where you provide a service in exchange for currency? God it slips my mind. There's plenty of them around despite what the media tells you. I'll think of it after the 404
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Workers of the world, unite!
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>>683670771
>So that's what communism is all about?
>Helping criminals be criminals?

No, I'm simply describing the inevitable end result of sticking with capitalism because everything is fine for you right now instead of transitioning to a sensible form of socialism. When the resources you're squandering run out, the bottom of the pyramid you've created will be coming after you.
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>>683670892
Damn.
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>>683658563
Anarcho-anything is cancer.
>>
The proletariat will rise.
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>>683656700
fuck you op
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>>683670932
It's amazing to me how many people think that government giving away money is teh communism
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>>683670932
not even a gommunist, but the whole,
>charity can do everything welfare can!
thing assumes a level of social trust and co-operation we simply don't have. It would work someplace like Japan, but not in the US. You'd just end up with a great depression-esque situation with vagrants that all the landed people hate wandering around and starving.
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>>683660687
Exactly. There's never been a successful implementation of communism - only fascism / totalitarianism.

That may well be because communism much like anarchist libertarianism relies too greatly upon homogeneity; people thinking alike, aspiring alike, behaving alike. In practice it doesn't work without the same hierarchical class structures it's intended to dismantle.
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>>683670692
Read it, they actually have parts saying pretty much what you said, humans not being naturally adapted to space but doing space travels anyway in order to keep a natural agressive form of evolution while also saying that their particular goverment and society model work because it's natural to humans, the fact that the insects are so good at war comes from the fact that their are biologically communists, which would be great for humans if it wasn't unnatural.

For real, the contradictions are very well thought and all in form of veiled propaganda, it's a great book
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>>683671066
So we just enable the worst to stay that way in the name of keeping them from revolting and ruining society for everyone. Or, now hear me out, or, we could stop telling everyone that they're special snowflakes(protip:they're not), and tell them at a very early age that if they try hard and apply themselves they will be able to earn everything they need and won't have to rely on the govt for anything except emergency services and infrastructure. I don't know man. My way seems to be more for the people than telling them they can just stay shitty
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>>683671267
Despotic socialism was seen by Marx as the inevitable step after capitalism and before full communism. He even outlined the measures that must be undertaken to bring a society to this despotic socialism which he believed would somehow evolve into communism. This is copied directly from The Communist Manifesto;

>"The proletariat will use its political supremacy to wrest, by degree, all capital from the bourgeoisie, to centralise all instruments of production in the hands of the State, i.e., of the proletariat organised as the ruling class; and to increase the total productive forces as rapidly as possible.

>Of course, in the beginning, this cannot be effected except by means of despotic inroads on the rights of property, and on the conditions of bourgeois production; by means of measures, therefore, which appear economically insufficient and untenable, but which, in the course of the movement, outstrip themselves, necessitate further inroads upon the old social order, and are unavoidable as a means of entirely revolutionising the mode of production.

>These measures will, of course, be different in different countries.

>Nevertheless, in most advanced countries, the following will be pretty generally applicable.

>1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.

>2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.

>3. Abolition of all rights of inheritance.

>4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.

>5. Centralisation of credit in the hands of the state, by means of
a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly.

>6. Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State.

>7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
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>>683670655
Lol, glad we all agree. Hear that Commie faggots? We don't like you. Stop pretending to be us.
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>>683671777
>8. Equal liability of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.

>9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.

>10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children’s factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, &c, &c."

The only one of these that was not put into effect by the Bolsheviks was the first part of No. 8, "Equal liability of all to work" (and even that was very nearly met). All of the rest were met by Soviet law. These conditions were also applied to the PRC, and many other states which called themselves communist before they either tore themselves apart or had to adopt much more practical policies.

It would be correct to say that those states were not communist (as the entire notion of a state being communist is preposterous, since communism refers to the societal absence of money, class and state), but they were very certainly Marxist and the only reason they weren't communist is because communism is literally impossible.
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>>683671362
No. It would work at a local level. But it's too late for the places like Detroit and Chicago where the charitable have already said, "they can't be helped. They won't help themselves."
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>>683671659
>if they try hard and apply themselves they will be able to earn everything they need

Yes, I know that's the Just World fantasy you live in.
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>>683671923
>Detroit and Chicago
That's what happens when you free market cucks send our work overseas. Protectionism is the only answer tbh
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>>683672435
No that's what happens when you have excessive state welfare systems that give overly generously and provide no incentive to work
Combined with over the top government policy on regulations of factories, excessive production and environment tax.

Laissez-faire is the only true answer.
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>>683672805
Pure economic theology
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>>683671939
Worked for me. I was well below poverty when I entered adulthood. Started smoking weed and not caring. It got worse and worse. Then I found out that if I quit smoking weed and applied myself I would have what I needed. So I quit weed, got a job, went to community college(stfu at least I did something) and now I make more than I need and can afford the things I want. Sure it took 5 years but if I knew it could be like this I would've hit adulthood as hard as possible with better HS grades and better college and have it even better than I do now. I just hope I can get that into my sons head. He's only 1 now. But I hope he grows up to be an earner and not a govt leech so he can provide for his family someday and not have to hope the govt still cares enough about white people to give him the scraps of what this social/communist world is trying to turn into.
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>>683672805
Except with the average wages being much higher in Detroit than in Shanghai, and shipping being extremely cheap, there's nothing to stop all manufacturing from going overseas because of the relative cost. It has nothing to do with state welfare systems, those cities only fell apart after the jobs vanished because of you globalist niggers and all the productive people left to find work elsewhere. THEN the state welfare systems propped up a dysgenic system of the dregs, because there were no jobs for anyone to get anyways. There's no reason not to have a state welfare system if you have a little bit of care for you own people and work to keep jobs available to them.

>>683672959
this
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To a Western Communist: Communism is cool artsy propaganda posters, badass antifa protesting the ebil police, books that you've never read but are intellectual according the culture of Communism, Noam Chomsky!, and heroic Soviet marches (even though they are all Czarist).

To actual Communists: Suicide watch, gulags, breadlines, shit military life, shallow graves, wake up-work-eat-work-home-sleep repeat.

Hurray for Communism! Go ahead fight me I'm an ex-Marxist.
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>>683673110
That's how it usually work according to most researchers, the problem is that most of the people arguing agains welfare have very immediatist lines of thought.
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>>683656700
look it a "we're going to have a revolution" circle jerk. remember comrade you need a job to be considered working class.
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>>683673567
>I'm an ex-Marxist
>I discovered I like money and privilege more than wisdom and virtue

cool story bro
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>>683667104
>>683667692

Actually child labour still exists and capitalism is to blame. You ignorant slut.
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>>683673825
I don't even argue against welfare. But the people receiving it should either legitimately need it or are in need of a leg up on their way to finding employment. Not riding that shit like a fucking prize steed that they're proud of.
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>>683674088
exploiters gonna exploit
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>>683673949
>marxism is wisdom and virtue

Don't make me laugh.
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>>683670842
Hong Kong today
Capitalism will make niggers of us all
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>>683674317
I thought it was only fair to return the favor.
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>>683673949
Wisdom and virtue don't get pussy and food and shelter and transportation and basic human dignities but hey, I has a smrat and I isn't a big meany doodoo head
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>>683673949
Not the same anon, but I take it that you're a philosophy major.
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>>683674408
No, no - you only take pictures of the rich people at the top of the pyramid! You're doing it all wrong!
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>>683674559
If I was a philosophy major then I wouldn't believe in wisdom or virtue.
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>>683670932
Charity never solves social problems. Government programs sometimes do.
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>>683674498
I don't support trickle-down economics you obtuse child.
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>>683671046
It should say ideology not communisim. This argument holds for basically any ideology.
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>>683674818
>not muh flavor of capitalism

No true scotsman much?
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>>683674716
Cept for when they usually don't
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>>683674903
and so on *sniff*
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>why the reactionary kids just don't get it
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>>683674918
I'm not a capitalist at all
>>
I've never met a communist that could pull his weight
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>>683674999
Change the sometimes to usually don't and it is still better then the nothing charity does to solve actual problems.
>>
Ok so what am I if I want as little govt interaction as possible and I believe that everyone at an individual level can achieve at the very least self sustainability through hard work and determination to the point that I believe it shouldn't be my responsibility to make sure very poor person is taken care of because the govt is forcing me but would help out someone I knew personally if they genuinely needed it
>>
>>683674713
https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/philosophy
>The original meaning of the word philosophy comes from the Greek roots philo- meaning "love" and -sophos, or "wisdom."

You make it sound as if wisdom or virtue compared to philosophy are mutually exclusive. Whatever let's you sleep at night, buddy.
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>>683675753
If you had actually gone to college, you would have thought that was funny.
>>
>>683666944
I know an Objectivist who in the past twenty years has saved over 40 people from drowning
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>>683676050
Could the rest not afford his service?
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>>683675518
It's still not a worthwhile endeavor. Not with my money. Here's a better idea. All across the nation put it to a local vote. Think SPLOST programs. This specific community that you drive through or know of that's in your town gets the vast majority of a +1-2¢ sales tax increase in the form of social programs and benefits. They build multimillion dollar schools and infrastructure this way all the time and it usually gets passed by vote by a landslide. As an opponent of welfare culture I could actually get behind it if it was my community. Do this everywhere and it could help more than "Obama say you buy jayquon college"
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>>683660868
Why the fuck do you think it failed? Maybe because the Soviets were continuously ravaged by wars and invasions? I'm sure that had nothing to do with it.
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>>683675879
Ah. Completely missed the joke. Toots on my horn. You got me.
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>>683676421
Americans don't know that the United States invaded Russia during the revolution to attack the Bolsheviks.
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>>683676421
And that's the crux of why everyone laughs at your pathetic ideology. You always have an excuse for why it failed and it almost always boils down to "meanies wouldn't let us do communism". The USSR had plenty of war-free years. So did many other communist nations. They still didn't transform into a magic happy land absent of money, class and state. How about you make an attempt to explain how despotic socialism would EVER lead to that?

>>683676586
We didn't invade, we just provided military aid to the White Russians. Same as the brits, frogs, japanese, and other nations.
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>>683677103
>We didn't invade, we just provided military aid to the White Russians

mysides.jpeg
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>>683677103
The United States has never invaded a foreign country! We just provide military assistance to elements within countries that support our geopolitical interests!
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>>683661664
fuck off nigger
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>>683673949

>wisdom and virtue
>marxism

Read a book

Literally ANY book
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>>683674818
well no ones perfect.
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>>683674498
well that's why your broke I guess.
>>
>>683677548
Nah, the US has done a ton of nasty shit. Mostly in recent years in the middle east. But seriously, the Allied intervention in the October Revolution saw very little in the way of actual American troops in Russia. Hardly anything that could be called an invasion, There were total about 5,000 who didn't just dick around in Vladivostok doing parades and shit. Compared to the 70,000 japanese, for example. Most of the rest of it was just money and supplies being sent to the White Russians. I know propaganda is fun, but words do have meanings and "invade" does not fit here.
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>>683674088
then why not get rid of your iPhone.
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>>683672435
I love the misinformed.
>>
>>683677103
>>683677548
>we just provided military aid
you guys do that a lot though, does having dictators fucking with people help that much?
>>
>>683671939
worked for me. maybe you're doing something wrong. like everything.
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>>683674088
>posted from my computer over the internet
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>>683670655
worthless faggot looking for handout
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>>683678502
I think maybe he hasn't had a job yet. Like might be in college or maybe even in high school still. Mommy probably drinks till she can bear to fuck daddy, who would slap the shit outta junior here if he heard the feefee based bullshit his Carl the Cuck lookin ass son is spewing all over the Internet, and he's in the basement like "muh socialist utopia!!!" Even tho he's got the best computer best house best phone best everything that daddy earned thru capitalism. Wait! I think I broke the code!!! We have this problem with socialists that have never worked thinking just that. Since they've never had to work and everything was provided to them via daddehs money they think if the "daddies" of society keep paying their way everything will just work out! Socialism and communism are just pure jealousy thinly veiled in equality for all. I don't like that you have more than me but I'm not willing to do what it takes to have the same nice things.
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>>683670447
actually the opposite is true. almost 80 percent of soviets wanted the ussr to continue
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_Union_referendum,_1991
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>>683667938
>no context
>no proof of such accusations
>can be a bs view trying to illude others
>learn 2 english first
>hitler was left (national SOCIALISM)
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>>683667674
oh gawd that stupid cunt never read marx fucking cunt retarded president BAIT
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>>683681056
>getting this buttmad over someone posting reagan
>>
hey gringos your arguments against communism are fucking retarded. ANARCOCOMUNISM FOR THE WIN
>>
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>>683678515
>>683678313
Being imbeded in a system doesn't presuppose your agreement in said system. You pair of fuckin idiots.
>>
>>683681778
>implying they said it does
>>
>>683681412

That was a hard fuckin' read.
>>
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>>683681599
>gringos

You have to go back, paco
>>
>>683680876
Original post:
>Other people argue that Hitler was a left wing comunist
Your comment:
>hitler was left (national SOCIALISM)
Anon needs to learn english as much as you need better reading skills
>>
>>
>>683682053
good luck gringos trump is destroying your country what was left of it JAJAJA the fucking world is laughing at you! TRUMP IS A FUCKING JOKE
>>
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>>683681599
>hey gringos your arguments against communism are fucking retarded.

And

>ANARCOCOMUNISM FOR THE WIN

is your argument
>>
>>683662189
is this divided down the middle or a four-part comic?
>>
>>683661990
Can't fuck with russia can't fuck with China. That's what. They ain't just farmers anymore bobo.
>>
>>683658882
Oddly enough there is a certain duality paradox that you almost touched upon in your statement. It is such that if you abolish the private ownership of capital then the ownership must be transferred to the public. The government is the representative of the people no matter its form. Even the purest democracies are vulnerable to politically minded families creating hereditary dynasties within the system. Therefore within a few generations both the capital and political system will be in the hands of a few familial dynasties or "kings"
>>
>>683664940
You mean dealerships protected by govt from direct competition w manufacturers. Yeah. Eat shit.
>>
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A stubborn rich man with lots of money is nothing compared to an angry worker with a gun.
>>
>>683661664
>numbers I post online are reliable and/or in proper context
I'll keep my guns and booze, thanks
>>
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>>683661319
Death to Fascism!!!

Long live the Bolshevik Revolution!!!!!
>>
>>683662216
>implying capitalists don't let muthafuckas starve if they don't play ball
>implying any of you are better than a snail
>>
>>683661370
On behalf of the brave American Volunteers,
you are welcome, comrade Spaniard!
>>
>>683685040
Yeah... No. That's not how it works.
>>
>>683663961
>implying your vote influences anything outside local elections
>>
>>683656700

They ate each other when Stalin starved them.
>>
>>683661490
What "freedom" are you referring to?
As a committed Marxist, I am not interested in telling you how to live.
>>
>>683656700
American commie here. One day, comrade.
>>
>>683665484
nigga bringing up the sumerians
shit
got
real
>>
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>>683656700
>Where my poorfags at
fixed
>>
>>683665420
define rich
>>
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>>683661636
Death to Fascist tyrants everywhere!!!!
>>
You God damn communist heatens, you had best sound off that you love the Virgin Mary, or I'm gonna stomp your guts out!

Now, you do love the Virgin Mary, don't you?
>>
>>683686396
Are we sure he said this? Russia had no democracy when he was alive, what the fuck is he referring to? America?
Seems a little to convenient.
>>
>>683685864
We let people fail. If you want to be lazy go be lazy somewhere else. The adults are working. You're operating on the fallacy that all human life is precious. It's not
>>
>>683661370

That worked out well didn't it... A pitiful band of rebels skimming the cream of the aid they got and handing down the crumbs to the people doing the fighting in the way of ancient and defective weaponry and ammunition. Typical communism.

No wonder the Nationalists won.
>>
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>>683656700
>Where my freedom hating assholes at.

Fixed that for you, you totalitarian piece of garbage.
>>
>>683660188
just think of how many childs in Africa die from diseases and malnutrition at this moment, that's capitalism's fault, and not just in Africa, it is worldwide
>>
>>683664006
there is a mistake in that picture, Spanish fascist dictator was named Miguel Primo de Rivera not Jose Antonio.

Jose Antonio was his nephew who funded a fascist political party called Falange which is still active nowadays in Spain.
>>
>>683686148
Not really the argument I was making but sure. In the grand scheme of things votes in national elections mean very little if not nothing at all
>>
>>683686122
thats exactly how it workshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMWmYJOa-BM
>>
>>683685115
This is true for people living in anything but a 1st world country. And those lucky enough to live in a 1st world country are too comfortable in their own poverty to climb the ladder, or bring the rich man down since people in 1st world countries care more about their lives than the rest of the world. As long as a wealthy man hands down a dollar to the poor to keep them content, a plutocracy will always be in power. There's a reason why we're transitioning to nations of international multi-conglomerate corporations. Even in the communist countries that declare themselves communists, it's only a matter of time before a corporate fast food restaurant reaches their neighborhood.
>>
>>683686560
>where my lazy no job wanting poorfags at

FTFY
>>
>>683666342
>the only actual argument in the thread for the continued existence of Communism
The problem here, niggers, is that the Capitalists think too small, with respect to incentives and motivation, and the Communists think too large.
Y'all motherfuckers need to meet me in the middle. City-States.
>>
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>>683663937
>>
>>683685627
The Beer Hall Putsch was more successful :^)
>>
>>683687017
ha are you trollin wit this shit? capitalism really doesn't explain what happened to africa the story begins with imperial powers colonizing and that isnt an economic theory's fault USSR was a colonizer too ya know
>>
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>>683687017
>just think of how many childs in Africa die from diseases and malnutrition at this moment, that's capitalism's fault

remind me again how western nations providing at least 80% of the GDP of all sub-saharan african countries makes it our fault when their population shoots past a sustainable number and they have starvation.

remind me how their lack of proper hygiene causing disease is the fault of capitalism

also remind me how all those "People's liberation army" groups going around doing most of the exploitation are capitalist
>>
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>>683664356
Comrade Zero here.
I am a Marxian Socialist.

I have lived in my own place since my US Army days; that's 31 years.
So bite the wax tadpole, nimrod.
>>
>>683687338
Not the same anon, but the only way you're going to get any compromise or actual change is at the lives of others. And let's be honest, you're never going to do that because you're no Che. You just wear the shirt, hold a sign, and argue online.

If you want to get things done, you know what to do.
>>
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>>683656700
This thread needs some serious liberty.
>>
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>>683688144
Look everyone - an oldfag unicorn!

Or a liar.
>>
>>683687782
I said not just Africa millions of people die of hunger and they are mostly kids, homeless kids, they dont receive medical attention and they have never go to an school, and they never will. Why? capitalism

Please don't use that kind of vocabulary we are having a decent exchange of opinions ;)
>>
>>683665578
Uhhhmmm, okay.

Recall the side who won?

Here's a reminder :
>>
>>683688144
>So bite the wax tadpole

So drink Coka Cola?
>>
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>>683688308
Anarcho-anything puts you in the basement, neckbeard. Lose the fedora or fuck off.
>>
>>683665587
>>
>>683687929
its bad administration and corruption, you have a point, what i try to say is that with socialism implemented in Africa, things would be better
>>
>>683686747
>posts a Space Marine
>the elite soldiers of THE most famous fictional fascist regime
>implying pinko commie scum aren't Tau
>>
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Animal Farm my friends, don't trust anyone.
>>
>>683686757
SIR YES SIR
>>
>>683658358
Jews created the LGBT movement Jews created the Communist movement.
>>
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>>683665935
So says the guy who shot himself rather than face the Red Army.
>>
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>>683666342
>>
>>683660269
All for the communism but... Please don't molest my Ohio flag again.
>>
>>683688641
Fuck you bitch. An-cap for life. I buy things, sell things, mind my own fucking business. You should to state cuck.
>>
>>683689297
Underage faggot.
>>
>>683667753
Russia had forced labor in their penal system going back to rule by the Romanov Tsars.
>>
>>683688414
capitalism still doesn't fully explain malnutrition and so forth in Africa. It is a highly fertile continent but agriculture has been wiped out by generations of tribal in-fighting and genocide. They do more to themselves than anything else. All i'm saying is Aftrica is not a good example of why capitlalism doesnt work. A good example would be trade exploitation of Mexico caused by NAFTA or something along those lines but even that argument is fraught with problems because the trade does work both ways to an extent
>>
>>683686757
>says the overweight American Burgerlord who had their army beaten by Kent State and a bunch of 80 IQ gooks in Vietnam.
>also bailed on Korea. Good job fam.
>>
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>>683688438
>Germany, fighting on three fronts, besieged by 51 countries, and dealing with the retarded decisions of the Italians still manages to hold out for five years
>USSR barely wins on their front, suffering massive casualties despite having far more soldiers as well as the entire combined aid of the Allied forces behind them shipping in weapons, tanks, artillery, food, etc.
>subjects conquered eastern europe to such shitty conditions over the next 45 years that they wholly reject anything marxist or even leftist, even today
>2016
>>"lol we won man here's a reminder"
>>
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>>683688641
Meh, I'm an an-cap in principle but a pragmatist as well. I know that getting rid of the state entirely will never happen, certainly not in my lifetime. So what I simply push for is liberty. Or does it really not bother you that the state is so absurdly huge that the police constantly shut down children's lemonade stands since they don't have business permits, in some places you need a license to braid hair, or the police freely can strangle you to death in broad daylight because you sold loose cigarettes for 25¢ a piece?

I know I fucking don't.
>>
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>>683670655
Courageous Occupy protester.

Death to the nazifags! !
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