like, god damn, I really, really want out, but we couldnt handle the economic repercussions of leaving, and the resulting dip would almost certainly hand the next election to labour, maybe when we are more economically stable the dream can come true.
>>683646939 england belongs to the mudslimes now who the fuck cares? the thing i am more concerned about is how we (america) are going to get control of your nukes before you get a mudslime prime minister.
>>683646939 In. Completely in. b/tastic cuntishness aside, it's a simple three-prong decision- History has proven that inclusion and togetherness always defeats separation in the end (and don't be so 13 as to talk about Islamic extremism or immigration, because I'm an old cunt and I remember the Berlin Wall coming down, the concerns about the last wave of immigration and the one before that...every wave being greeted as the end of our fucking Britishness, and you know what? Every measurable quality shows our quality of life rising constantly for the past 50 years), No-one has provided any compelling economic or socio-political evidence anything would improve, just endless scaremongering, and I just look at the scumbags pushing for an exit, and it is REALLY easy to line up on the other side of the line.
everyone voting out rely needs to understand that it will take YEARS to fully negotiate all the bits and pieces of the treaties and we will still need to follow EU law on a lot of things just to be able to access the market...
look at iceland - they left and ONLY needed to renegotiated fishing rights and trade..it took 4 years.
Probably out. Both sides are full of bullshit but I keep coming back to the fact that the UK never chose to be in - we signed up to the common market and then just drifted ever closer in to the EU - to a system that effectively governs us but over which were have very little democratic control.
In the cloud of xenophobia, misinformation and latent imperialism, the Brexit fucktards heve not yet mentioned Article 50 ONCE
If the UK votes to leave, we will have NO SAY in HOW weleave. The terms of our exit, things like our outgoing trade deals and economic standing, will be decided by Brussels. We will not be able to suggest or instist on anything
This will last 2 years. At the end of it, we can either say yes to Europe'sterms, meaning we could have a shitty deal, or refuse to accept it, in which case we will be absolutely fucked for the next 20 years
All this shit about 'taking back our borders' is bullshit as well. We do not have the same border treaty with the EU as land-locked EU countries do. We will on fact lose our border force in calais, meaning what little control they have over the migrants coming over here will completely vanish as the French government orders the French border patrol to step aside and letthe migrants onto the ferries.
We have to stay in. leaving will destroy this country within 5 years
>>683649434 Tory? Sorry babes, old-school Socialist Labour; Corbyn's a little too central for me. I know you're meant to get more right-wing as you get older, but seems to be the opposite with me. And yes, it does feel weird to be aligned, even briefly, with the most awful right-wing scumbags we've had for a good while...but it doesn't change the way I feel.
>>683648813 You're a fucking moron, Turkey can't join the EU in a couple months, no country can join the EU for the next 5 years and Turkey still has about 75 benchmarks to pass before getting into the EU.
>>683648907 But if you don't get out now, you'll never get out. If you get out, sure, you'll take a hit. But you'll bounce back better. If you wait with he intent to get out when you're doing better, Merkel will never let you get "better" and you'll be in forever. A little pain and suffering goes a long way in the long run
I live just north of london and I hear polish every time I go out, every town centre shop is polish, all my neighbours are polish. They come here for the money then fuck back off to poland after 3-5 years.
1. Because people are retarded if they think Russia/China/rest of the world are going to be signing favourable trade deals with us outside of the EU. If there was anything suggesting this then maybe there is an economic argument but given the rest of financial world says "don't leave" it's wildly optimistic to assume they will reward us for leaving.
2. The UK is the only country in the EU where you can opt out of the working time directive (already a bad sign). UK employee rights are kept in check (barely) by the EU. If we leave those on minimum wage can enjoy zero-hour contracts and the higher earners can look forward to 10 days a year holiday and 18 hour working days. China/US style.
>>683648624 At least we don't vote for spineless politicians who limit free speech, resulting in putting Markus Meechan behind bars for teaching his dog to go crazy in response to saying "Gas the Jews" AS A JOKE Pic related: it's the dog saluting in response to "Sieg Heil."
>>683650134 Thank you. because media outlets are biased as fuck. The BBC are doing an OK job but every now and again there's the odd 'uh-oh[' moment, but so far they've kinda kent their nose clean
>>683650176 It IS - that's the problem. The border control in Calais is half us, half Frence - but this is a mutual agreement, and could be rescinded at any time - and you can bet that should we leave, our nice welcome will be swiftly retracted, and then there would be nothing to stop the fuckers walking through the tunnel
>>683649258 Those immigrants were other Europeans. Now you're dealing with sharia law enforcing 1400 years regressed backwards assed people that literally hate you and your way of life. All I can say if you wind up staying in is good luck. I hope the colonies don't have to come clean house when they start beheading people in the street and throwing rocks at women without burkas or male escorts.
>>683649950 Eh fair enough, you're entitled to your opinions but Cameron is as much a danger to social cohesion as the EU imo. Wouldn't like anything more than to collapse the Channel Tunnel with him and his cronies in it.
>>683646939 Out. With every single fibre of my being, Out. Like the kids in Billy Talent's Red Flag said, "We want out! We want out!"
I want my country's border control back. And anybody who says we have them right now with uncontrolled mass immigration is either a liar or a fool. Look at the ghetto areas of Birmingham or Lincoln. You wanna see how bad it really is? Go and see the people lining up outside the Home Office in Croydon.
I want my country's sovereignty back. 70% of our country's laws are made in Brussels. That fact is confirmed both by the Office of National Statistics and the House of Commons library so don't try to claim it isn't true. It empirically fucking is.
I want my country to be able to deport foreign criminals and not to have to always abide by the ECHR. Because every single fucking time they pull the 'right to a family life' card and get indefinite leave to remain.
And do you want to know the worst part? ISIS have told us, FUCKING TOLD US, that they're sending people among the refugees. Photos were posted on /b/ proving it. And those complete and utter fucking morons in the EU want to 'save' as many refugees as they possibly can. Just.......no. Just fucking no. Or we'll have a dozen more Paris-style attacks.
I want my country back. Say it with me. I WANT MY COUNTRY BACK!
>>683650819 The Jamaicans were Europeans? Interesting. I remember when there were going to be gangs of Yardies carving up London town between them, packs of feral blacks rampaging through our streets raping the white women, etc etc... It's all nonsense, and it never changes.
You're not important. Your britbong market is a export champ is services only. Financial services though, not anything else. There are already talks being held to swap London for a more pro-EU location like Luxembourg or Brussel, so we are even going to snatch away the only thing that creates money on your small island. Besides, to suggest that 60 million brits are somehow better, and more capable to negotiate, then the rest of the 440 million EU citizens is retarded.
You do understand that the core countries of the EU are: BeNeLux + Germany/France + Italy? And that the EU pretty much only exists to support the export market of this supergroup. The UK is as important to the EU as is Bulgaria.
>>683649630 Oh yeah i agree mate. but its worth pointing out that any one who thinks an OUT vote will just cut all ties and make us "lel pro uk bros" realy doesn't understand the argument.
large amounts of the things we get from and sent to the EU will still be regulated by EU law and we will need to follow that.
we can (and will) throw out weight around.. we are like 5th in the world (3rd in EU i think) in export/import but we're gonna get fucked by the painfully slow EU bureaucracy system and you know they will do every thin in their power to fuck us over at every turn... it will be a tough few years.. but probably worth it in the end
Just a reminder that i am voting out.. im just realistic about the hardships that will bring
>>683649258 >.every wave being greeted as the end of our fucking Britishness, and you know what? Every measurable quality shows our quality of life rising constantly for the past 50 years) Why do you think Britishness = quality of life? Are you retarded? London is a British minority right now. You think that's not a decline on Britishness?
>>683651242 Why the fuck were there Jamaicans in Europe? Either way all that other shit I said still stands. You're dealing with an ancient civilization that cares not how progressive you are. Have fun with that.
I just think the scaremongering from the in side is pathetic, no-one actually knows, but it's in all countries interests to work together and trade with each other. Maybe in the short term we lose a few percent on our profits but in time it'll even back out. Mind you, not that the Out side can know this, either...
>>683649250 >implying you cunts don't already control our nukes
The great irony of the "free world" is how it must bow to America or face the consequences. This was seen in the Suez Canal incident, which pretty much established the UK as the 51st state. A lot of the blame for what is happening in Europe right now can be laid at the feet of the USA. As individuals you're fine, but your government and the corporations based in your country are ruthless in the pursuit of their interests, and western values, culture, and the white race mean absolutely nothing to them. They worship the dollar and nothing else.
>>683650869 that article is pretty supportive of him but i get the idea. if your in an area like brixton a good selling point is diversity, gets the niggers excited id also like to say that this was before he was elected so yeah
>>683650868 not really, but maybe (I see your point). The problem is that should the migrants want to come through en masse, several things would happen: the Tunnel trains would stop, causing a backlog on the M20 (op stack), Thousands of extra police and emergency services would have to be brought in, at cost to the tax payer, to police the new arrivals
Right wing groups would no doubt mass at Shakespeare cliffs and in Dover (they've been doing that a lot lately) and further bloodhsed would ensue
France has been completely inept at halting the migrants arriving at their doorstep. They want nothing more than to get the fuckers out of their town, because they're destroying it.
Staying in would give us time to sort it out. leaving would mean millions, if not billions oftaxpayer's pounds being spent in a very short time to stop kent imploding
>>683651133 I'm with you, man, no doubt. Cameron is poison, and he is systemically undermining so many things I love about this gorgeous country, and I am actively engaged in the process to get rid of him and his cronies. But on this single issue - and please understand it's hard for me to say - we agree.
>>683646939 Leave the EU, for the sake of Europe leave the EU. The EU needs to die so cracking down on the Muslim invaders can full force happen. Merkel out of power and the collapse of the EU would be open season on the Muslim invaders
Right wing voters are typically lower class. They will be the first ones to lose their jobs. Those idiots just lack the intellectual capacity to realize that. One, two years after Britain left, they'll be beging to get back in.
Btw, the even if Britain votes to leave the EU the actual process isn't going to happen within a days period.
>>683651854 I cant say I know much on the subject because I dont but isnt the whole reason, well one of the big reasons is because of how much money we spend on or with the EU? Surely that money we're not spending on the EU can go towards stuff like what you just mentioned?
>>683651160 Of course London adds weight. The economic power-house of the country. Working and living anywhere else means you aren't particularly exposed to EU regulations/migration/competition laws etc.
I cannot understand the demand for change? Currently we have it better than most of Europe and we still bitch and moan and pre-teens call for revolution because they think its edgy.
Sovereignty is such a non-argument. "my decisions are made in Brussels!" so? Decisions for Stockton are made in London so what... Stockton independence?
TBH this country is fucked regardless. The damage has been done due to the current numbers of immigrants and their large birth rates compared to native Brits. If you don't live in a major city or a multicultural county like Yorkshire for example, i doubt you are aware of how bad things really are. If Trump wins the election i will look to move to America within his, hopeful, 8 year reign.
>>683651462 I've never considered Britishness to mean simply 'whiteness' (which is what your 'London minority' actually means, don't forget). But you're right, I conflated two terms without being more clear, and that wasn't helpful. Apologies.
Please stay in lads most of EU migrants are moving to London to work in very specific fields I'm French and I'm going to teach French at King's College If you don't want anymore Poles that's fine but we can work out an arrangement on that, the Portuguese are good construction workers too
>>683649497 >We will on fact lose our border force in calais,
No we fucking wont! This got proven bullshit the day Cameron said it. Our boarder with calais is compeltely non EU realted, its between France and England only and would not be effected. It's just more bullshit to pressure dumb fucks like you into shitting yourself and staying in a broken, liberal fascist super state.
>>683650032 They won't have to, because shipping to UK officially became way more expensive. Essentially all you are doing is making your EU tradings more difficult, putting a strain on you economy.
And for what? So that you can soothe the worry of paranoid plebs?
Let's be honest. This is just another empty move made by European politicians who underestimated just how fast a significant part of their population would jump on a right wing bandwagon as soon as things don't go as smoothly as they had hoped.
But sure. Have your own personal ivory tower. And see how long you can sustain that on your own, without going full Swiss-neutral.
>>683652380 >I've never considered Britishness to mean simply 'whiteness' It doesn't, but it's certainly a factor. To deny that being white isn't a factor in British history is utterly ludicrous. On top of that, that's not what "London minority" actually means. What it "actually means" is entire areas of London that are black and speak almost only Arabic. It's British people being attacked on the streets for drinking alcohol. Women being attacked for wearing short dresses. That is not Britishness.
>>683652429 The poles? Everyone I know loves the poles. They work hard and actually do amazing jobs. its the fucking mudslimes we need to stop they are ruining every country they touch and yours is already fucked.
You won't be ignored though. But since you won't be in the EU it will not be your financial institutions dealing with that will have the opportunity to directly handle EU trade, which will be done by a bank acutely in the EU.
For example: Although Norway's banks and the most financial healthy in Europe, non of their banks can directly handle EU trade.
>>683652514 >semantics Boy, you're really good at arguing.
>>683652552 >but the whole of Islam Yes. 50% of all muslims in the UK want homosexuality to be illegal. If I'm not mistaken, upwards of 60% wouldn't inform the police if a friend or family member got involved with extremism. Their idea of the perfect human, untouchably perfect in his glorious wisdom, was a literal child rapist warmongerer. All muslims are a ticking timebomb. You see it every weak when some high profile muslim comes out and says "Don't insult Islam or you'll make more terrorists". If all it takes is a few mean words for these cunts to become suicide bombers, then they aren't welcome.
>>683652757 Jeremy corbyn will be next president, and he will be one of the working people and migrants. He wants to remove executive powers from the queen, and thus he may be able to remandate an entry if we do leave.
Special snowflake Londoners are the only ones that know what impact the EU has? Try being a farmer , or any one of the other jobs nationwide that are impacted by EU regulation from packaging to health and safety.
>>683652616 Alot of our population has known nothing other than being in the EU. We managed before it, even prospered before being in it and yeah you cant really base voting in or out on what happened before your generation but I'm still going to be voting out.
>>683652624 Sounds more like your police force is failing you.
Let me guess. The solution your politicians made was more survailance in public places. Guess what. They do that in literally every Western country, just do dodge the actual issue. Which is that they failed to form a proper executive force and enforce already existing laws and regulations in terms of migration and asylum. Why? Because none of them want to be the ones to tell the people that they want to spend more money on bureaucracy.
>>683652624 No, I agree. But it's so vital not to equate incidents with trends - there's been no systematic research into the frequency of these incidents, so we're all going off hearsay and paid-for media. It's such a bloody quagmire of misinformation, and it scares me. Because if the doomsayers are right, things may get bad. And if they're wrong, then what else are they lying to us about? How would we know? Half the time I think 'let all the foreigners in, expel all the politicians & media barons'.
that goes both ways man... if i want to go live in Spain for a bit then i can with no problem. while i still can do that with an out vote it will be harder. Its still possibl for the migrants to come here.. just will be a bit more paper work
>>683653292 correct, I know nothing of this situation other than what you two have stated. I'm asking if the guy really went to jail for teaching his dog to do a trick when he said something that most people would find repulsive.
EUfag here. You Brits are behaving like special needs kids with peanut allergies and an all organic vegan feminist diet. Uhuh I want this, I want that, I want everything my way, EU is oppressing me, EUtriarchy, muh rights, I want muh borders back. Well fuck off then, you bunch of wankers. We need real men to deal with the problems here in the EU, not you sissies. Piss off and let us solve the problems. You can rot on your shitty island and fall into the worst economic crisis since 19whenever, see if we care. Fuck off.
Not to mention where I live in Northern Ireland, all of our Farms receive a lot of funding from the European Union. They give us half of the money we give them back to invest in our farms. If we didn't give the money in the first place, we could double the investment and support for Local Produce. Not only would this make it easier for local businesses but it would support the local economies, create jobs, increase production and lower imports of the same goods from other countries, saving fuel costs, foreign taxation, regulation and manpower.
On farming, leaving the EU is without a doubt the clearest and best outcome for them, economically and practically.
Wtf is wrong with you brits? Why the fuck would any country, much less a powerful, rich one, give up their rights to govern themselves in favor of unelected leftist assholes that havent run anything? You now have a chance for freedom again, and 45% of you want to stay in? Thats fucking crazy. You guys are such pussies
>>683653311 >when making decisions that will significantly change the future of my country and my children, I like to make affective decisions. I also like to make sure that my oppinions firmly represent these emotions. Especially fear and anger. Because, as we know through history, these are the BEST motivators for political movements.
Honest question from an Amerifat. How is it when the prospect of Greece leaving the EU came up, it was all doom and gloom for the survival of the EU, but yet when there is talk now about the BREXIT, it's all doom and gloom for the UK and the EU really doesn't need them anyway?
Losing a fucked up broke country like Greece would be a mortal wound to the EU, but losing one of their top three economies is like meh?
I moved to the UK from America around 6 months ago and all I've learned so far is you guys are full of yourselves but have fucking nothing of true value, no natural resources, no industry, not even social integrity. You despise all immigrants equally and make life a pain for them even though they bring a lot of money into your shitty country. It's also funny how you think leaving the EU will get rid of arabs and shitskin terrorists, while you already have a lot of dirty pakistanis, niggers, and other shits living legally here and calling them british. UK is crap, face it.
>>683653994 It's reverse psychology. They're acting as if they don't want us so that we will think we need them more. Unfortunately for them, they underestimate the stubbornness of the average British person. This strategy will likely backfire on them.
>>683646939 Out. The funny thing is that project fear is trying to make out the world will collapse if the UK takes control over its own laws and borders, or that everyone will cease to trade with the country with the 5th highest GDP on earth.
Its pretty simple really, nobody in their right mind would say "well we should let a load of people control our borders and laws whom we never elected or can give feedback to".
I'm anxious about the future if we leave the EU, I'm not scared. I'm scared of more oppressive and restrictive laws being written in a different country for us. I'm scared of the federalisation of Europe and the power wielded against Sovereign Democracy. I'm scared of a European Army, of aggressive expansion by Europe, of EU Coup's, of EU politicians we don't get to elect (Ones thar matter, anyway). I'm scared of my country becoming like Greece, Spain, Italy, Sweden. I'm scared of the EU, not because I'm some weak limbed nonce but because the EU is hostile to all member states who do not comply and it does not allow any form of true democracy and if it had it's way, we would all have One Leader, One Currency, One Army, One Newspaper, One Border, One Country, One Hell.
>>683653652 >On farming, leaving the EU is without a doubt the clearest and best outcome for them, economically and practically.
there would be nagotiations, new agreements, restrictions etc. no way the EU is gonna let the britbong famers get away with products below EU standards. so in essence, it would remain the same without EU funding.
>>683653125 Guy you replied to, and yes while he may be black, he's still more of a badass than any Brit. That doesn't mean I like him at all. But he hasn't tried to disarm me(yet) and he hasn't made it so that I have to get a permit for a butter knife either. So comparing him to any of you I'd take him all day.
Because then the media was trying to convince countries other than Greece to keep subsidizing them. Now they are trying to convince British citizens to stay in, so the narrative changes, logic be damned.
The EU is good for the powers that be, the big corporations, the very wealthy and the left wing political parties which pull the strings on the media.
The news will always reflect the interests of those who control it.
>>683654705 That's like getting mad at other people with the same insurance as yours getting sick and therefore making it a little more expensive. And then getting even more butthurt, when the insurance company attempts to teach a healthier lifestyle.
>>683654139 I also remember the list of I.R.A. terrorist attacks - did we nuke Belfast and ban them from popping over? Nope, we made peace and sought understanding. I remember the Cold War, when we were in ACTUAL danger, every man woman & child of us, and the list of dead there...did we win through exclusion and destruction? No, we sought understanding and detente, and we found peace that way. In every case, these people were 'the others', 'savages', 'beyond help', and in every case we won with peace, not slaughter.
You mean a union made to benefit wealthy industrialists across Europe
And getting butthurt over a bunch of Grecian retards spending themselves into a giant pit of debt over two decades and then running for the rest of us to save them like this shit somehow snuck up on them.
Greece is not a crisis, its a result of decades of irresponsibility and stupidity by their government.
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